While the U.S. government tries to prop up bloated, inefficient carmakers, European tram companies are making big money providing what cities actually need: streetcars and light rail cars.
I’m enough of a free trader to not really care where light rail cars come from, and perhaps the death of the American Streetcar industry is long past and neither worth obsessing over, nor worth rectifying through some sort of subsidy program.
But if the choice is between subsidizing a shrinking industry making cars, or a growing one making electric transit, the latter would seem to make more sense.
the hundred or so thousand auto-workers might disagree.
I really wish that someone would start a domestic LRV/Streetcar manufacturing company.
If I had Paul Allen’s money … that’s what I would spend it on … that and funding the entire uber-Seattle Streetcar network.
//the hundred or so thousand auto-workers might disagree.//
Not if many of them were at work building new rail cars. The things don’t build themselves.
If GM goes bankrupt a lot of could lose their jobs, but let’s be realistic: the personal automobile is not going to go out of fashion for a pretty long time. If GM goes bankrupt, it doesn’t mean that everyone loses their job like Enron. It’d probably be more like United Airlines, or something, where many people lost their job but many remained (and lost some pay/benefits). It’d be a way for GM to restructure their debts and obligations. But, you know, it goes both ways: if you work for a company that’s less valuable, then your skill/trade — unfortunately — is less valuable.
I think the states is going to need a strong manufacturing arm for windmills and other green tech, potentially including rail cars.
I doubt it’s as simple as “Okay, you’ve been building automobiles all your life, now hop to work building light rail cars! Come on, it’s exactly the same!”
It’s certainly not that simple, and training will take some amount of time. But it’s the same type of job that we’ll lose from the auto industry.
BTW … you put the margin on the wrong side of the photo
Gordon,
United Streetcar in Portland will be the domestic manufacture of the 10T Streetcars. I’ll be seeing the prototype under construction this weekend. It is basically 60% American, 40% from Skoda.
http://unitedstreetcar.com/
cool … thanks for the link … I’d assume this is where Seattle will shop when we expand the streetcar network?
a bit of trivia - Boeing may have been the last American company to make street cars. They made the first gen cars for San Francisco’s MUNI trains. Sadly - they didn’t hold up, after just 25 years they were replaced by the Silver Italian Breda trains that are in use now.
The Boeing trams were apparently a fiasco — see the NYC Subway entry on SF for more details (and lot of pictures of trolleys): http://world.nycsubway.org/us/sf/muni-streetcar.html
Regardless of how the workers feel about it, I’m a bit concerned about subsidizing them. Their basic problem is that GM’s product stinks and their design is totally out of date given the changes that are occurring in the world. I’m very concerned that subsidizing them now won’t change any of that. What’s the point in keeping them afloat if they continue to make the same mistakes?
Think of it this way, I’m about to replace my Japanese built SUV because it is long in the tooth. My pick? I’m leaning towards the Nissan Altima Hybrid. Why? Because it is a great car with good looks, great design, supposedly great reliability, and 35/33 mpg city/hwy.
Why do I bring up my pick for a car replacement? Because the NAH is built in Tennessee! It’s very interesting to note that Nissan is not asking for a bailout of its Tennessee plant (and workers), whereas GM is asking for a bailout of theirs. I.e., GM’s problems have a lot to do with GM’s products, and bailing them out won’t improve their products.
As a side note, you can’t get the NAH in WA because we aren’t one of the 7 states with strict environmental rules. Who would have thunk that we aren’t that Green in WA??
Yeah, my ‘01 Civic is rated as an ULEV (ultra-low emitting vehicle) because I bought it in California. Here ‘01 Civics are just rated LEV’s - they had to produce a version just for the California market. Also, my scooter has several emission related parts that are only in there because of California requirements (it wasn’t worth their effort to produce two separate versions). It’s long past time we caught up to California when it comes to emissions.
On a side note, I heard a public radio interview between an environmental activist and a Seattle concrete company and she couldn’t believe a certain type of coal-based concrete production that they use is even allowed here - it’s not legal in most other states due to air quality issues.
Do I hear “BAILOUT”? ;-)
If the Feds get involved they should take a clue from the agreement between California and Tesla Motors and lease equipment to startup companies that build railed vehicles or give money to the big three to provide job training or reconfiguration of equipment for railed vehicles. In return the auto manufactures would be required to give a discount to transit agencies.
If you think about it, there’s not a lot of difference between making a car and a tank or locomotive. That’s one reason nations subsidize auto industries- to have manufacturing capacity that can be turned to other purposes.
At the management level, though, the difference can be huge. The Boeing attempt to build light rail vehicles is renowned in the industry as the worst single mistake ever seen in transit. They were operational and maintenance headaches from the beginning, and the only reason Muni stuck with them was that they were able to buy entire fleets for a penny on the dollar from cities who quickly gave up on ever making them work.
In any case, American companies would face some stiff competition from European firms that have been building trams for decades and, having saturated the European market, are hungrily looking for expanding markets abroad.
Actual competition will be a new experience for American car builders who have hidden behind a “safety standards” ban on imports for decades.