Comments on: Long News Roundup (I)

By: Elbar

Elbar — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:41:34 +0000

Continuing the 75 along the 46 route would in fact eliminate the need for the 46 and give those living in North Ballard much faster access to the UDistrict.

By: Chris Stefan

Chris Stefan — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 16:14:35 +0000

One way to do it would be a route from downtown Ballard to the U-District along the route of the 46 express.

By: Elbar

Elbar — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 06:41:00 +0000

Wishing for a much faster all-day route between Ballard and the U-District, via Leary, Fremont and Northlake. Extending the 75 from Ballard to the U-District, thus making the 75 a circular route, is one way this could be done.

By: Jeff Welch

Jeff Welch — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:39:11 +0000

Charles,

Is every stop on each route considererd separately

Not each stop, but time points – listed on your printed timetable, the timetable at the stop, with additional time points listed on the driver’s run card.

There’s a couple of good articles on scheduling in the July http://www.atu587.com/documents/ATUJuly2009.pdf and August http://www.atu587.com/documents/ATUAugust2009-2-.pdf News Review, both written by actual schedulers. Doesn’t really address the lateness issue – but does give an insight into the complexities of time scheduling.

By: Jeff Welch

Jeff Welch — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:34:28 +0000

An addendum – at least in trolley land, if you’re late enough that your follower has caught up to you (meaning the next scheduled bus same route is now on your tail), a bus may blank its signs and stop picking up passengers (continuuing to do so only makes 2 buses late, with the follower winding up empty *and* late) until it catches up. A coordinator may also have a run turn around mid-route to get back on schedule for the next leg of the run. I’ve had a couple of scenarios where there were not 2, but 3 buses of the same route all running together because of game-day traffic or some such.

By: Steve

Steve — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 19:53:11 +0000

Seriously, Oran — that map is awesome. If we raised, say, $100 to cover costs, would you be able to post laminated versions of your maps in the main shelters in Ballard?

By: alexjonlin

alexjonlin — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 08:20:00 +0000

I think posting these at the major bus stops in major urban centers or even smaller urban villages would be great. I think your idea might have some merit, but it would have to be so big for everyone to actually be able to see where every route goes that its not worth it.

By: alexjonlin

alexjonlin — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 08:17:46 +0000

It’s on third just north of Cherry. I haven’t gotten a chance to use it yet, though.

By: alexjonlin

alexjonlin — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 08:15:14 +0000

Yes please! Oran, get yourself hired!
But I don’t think we have that few frequent arterial service routes… We have quite a few routes that come every 10 minutes or less for most of the day, or that combine with other routes for much of the day for 10 minute frequencies.

By: Oran Viriyincy

Oran Viriyincy — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 06:25:12 +0000

It is possible to put in several connecting routes as I have for the 48 but not too many. Adding in Magnolia and Phinney connecting routes would make the map sufficient for 95% of all travel purposes while keeping its legibility. And that’s enough. This doesn’t have to be the only map at the shelter.

I would also add an index. I have an index on my Capitol Hill map but not this one.

Some people wouldn’t look at a map that seems too complex because they get confused. I see people who ask the driver how to get somewhere even though that stop has the full system map with an destinations index AND the Downtown Seattle map. If it takes too long to figure out, people won’t read it.

Take a look at what information is shown at Paris bus stop and a London bus stop.

Anyway, I’m now going to design a complete Seattle Transit Map to complement the spider map.

By: Zach Shaner

Zach Shaner — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 05:39:41 +0000

Lloyd…maybe with pitch-in funding from PacPlace? =) One can dream…

By: Andreas

Andreas — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 04:17:27 +0000

I think your map would work great for the back side of one of those pole-mounted two- or three-schedule mounts, or as a pole-mounted map generally. Inside shelters, though, where there’s all that space to work with, it seems like a waste to not give more information. Information overload is a legitimate worry, but with larger maps people can select what information they need and sort of block out the superfluous stuff. With a tube-style map, though, there’s no way to gain extra information beyond the very minimal data that’s presented.

It just comes down to what’s not available on a tube-style map, and wondering how a rider would otherwise get that information if they’re already on the streets. How would I get to Magnolia, Phinney Ridge, the zoo or Green Lake from Downtown Ballard? These sorts of things drivers rarely know or have the time to help passengers figure out. Other passengers might not be around or also not know, and the customer service line is rarely available or helpful. Yet with a map, they’re very quick and easy to figure out.

(And I didn’t mean to suggest a full Metro map should be in each shelter, I was thinking more of just Seattle. You couldn’t fit all of Seattle on a Muni-size map, but you could fit about half.)

By: VeloBusDriver

VeloBusDriver — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 02:31:20 +0000

Realistically, we are not trained to keep on schedule, except for pulling out of our terminal on time. The mantra is “There’s a million reasons to be late, but none to be early”. I’ve never heard of anybody receiving a “PR” for being late although I suppose it can happen in extreme cases.

Metro rams “Safety, Service, Schedule” down our throats. I happen to believe that Schedule is part of Service, but that’s just me. Frankly, if you’re running for my bus and I’m 4 or 5 minutes behind, you’re out of luck. I’ve got 40-50 people back there who were on time who want to get somewhere and may have a connection they are trying to make. I only drive during rush hour so the next bus is probably no more than 10 minutes away. Don’t take it personally, ok?

By: Charles

Charles — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 02:15:27 +0000

So, five minutes is the standard. Thanks for that information.

Is every stop on each route considererd separately? For example, say the #15 from Ballard to downtown in the am peak hour is right on time for its fist few stops, then a couple minutes late to the next few, then later and later as it travels on its route. Then the last 5 stops before it reaches its last stop downtown it is more than 5 minutes late to each one. So, if there are 20 stops on some route, and the bus is less than 5 minutes late to 15 of them, and more than 5 minutes late on the last 5, that bus was 75% “on time”?

Or do they only count each route as one full route, and the only stop that matters is the last stop? So, if the bus completes its entire route without being more than 5 minutes late at its last stop it is 100% “on time”, but if it gets to the last stop more than 5 minutes late, it is 100% “late”, for that trip?

Anyone know how this is calculated? Each stop on its own? Or each entire route is either on time, or late?

By the way, is the standard the same for LINK light rail? What does ST calculate is the percentage of LINK trains that are “late”, and how does ST calculate that?

By: Jojo

Jojo — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 01:32:16 +0000

Unsure why Bellevue would be listed in the first article as a stalling boomburg. I think Bellevue ran out of land to sprawl out and is naturally transitioning to a more urban city – downtown Bellevue and Bel-Red developments etc.

By: Bernie

Bernie — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 00:38:04 +0000

Oops, that should say “Enrollment in the BSD was flat…”

By: Bernie

Bernie — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 00:36:54 +0000

I’m not sure where the author came up with his figures for Bellevue. Growth from 2000 to 2008 was 13%. School in the Bellevue School District was flat from 2006-07 to 2007-08 but is up almost 3% for the current year. And so far no signs that say “Will the last person in Bellevue please turn out the lights ;-)

By: Oran Viriyincy

Oran Viriyincy — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:48:36 +0000

It is a BS idea. A Ben Schiendelman idea of course! Providing a fun and interactive way for people to explore what their transit system has to offer is a good idea. This could be an evolution of an online interactive map that uses OneBusAway as the engine. A projector, PC and a few sensors don’t cost much. The software could be developed as a volunteer open-source effort like OBA.

By: Lloyd

Lloyd — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 22:44:10 +0000

What a GRRRRREAT idea, Ben – there could even be a 4 sided one toward the east end of the mezzanine at the crossing where the stairs come up from the tracks under 5th and Pine.

By: Ben Schiendelman

Ben Schiendelman — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 22:35:19 +0000

I would like to see that video. That’s exactly the kind of thing I’d like to have installed in Westlake (and perhaps in ID, Airport, etc).