On April 27, the “starter” segment of the 2 Line opened on the Eastside, connecting South Bellevue to the Microsoft campus in southwest Redmond. Prior to its opening, the line was expected to attract somewhere between 4,000 and 6,000 riders ($). As Sherwin Lee noted in September, ridership forecasting is for the line is complicated by the fact it serves a mix of existing commuter destination and new markets undergoing changes in land use and density. The following week, Sherwin rode after the celebratory ridership had ended, observing marked increased in use of the South Bellevue garage but relatively light use otherwise.
Earlier this week, the Sound Transit System Performance Tracker was updated with May’s ridership numbers for the 1 Line, but results for the first full month of 2 Line service were conspicuously missing. When reached via email for an explanation, Sound Transit explained that the 2 Line ridership data is being vetted for accuracy and to ensure expediency for future reporting. They estimated that 2 Line ridership will be included in regular reporting by the end of July.
In the meantime they noted opening weekend ridership (April 27 and 28) totaled 47,000 boardings, and total ridership in May was approximately 121,000 boardings.
Weekday ridership reportedly averaged “just under” 3,900 boardings, while Saturdays averaged 4,300 boardings and Sundays averaged 3,650 boardings.
As Summer approaches, it will be interesting to see how ridership evolves on the line during the busiest transit season of the year. Opening of the rest of the 2 Line across I-90 is still tentatively scheduled for the end of 2025.
Intrigued how Saturday has the highest ridership of the week
I was thinking the same thing.
I’m not surprised. Weekday and Saturday ridership have almost reached parity across the 1 Line. With a significant portion of Eastside workers working from home more often than not, it makes sense to me that Saturday would be the busiest day of the week for local travel/mobility.
There could also be an effect of folks deciding to “try it out” on a free Saturday rather than risking wasting time or getting stranded for a commute or an evening errand.
@Nathan,
Once RLE opens these discretionary trips should surge. There simply is a lot more opportunity for these kinds of non-work trips between DT Redmond and DT Bellevue than there is between mainly work oriented stops along the line.
The opening of RLE will be an excellent example of the “whole being greater than the sum of the parts”.
Thank you Aristotle for explaining Link ridership and the impact of RLE!!!!!
As an Eastsider who’s used the line occasionally to get to downtown Bellevue, I totally agree with Lazarus here.
Weekday is meaningless now… Friday is very light ridership, then Mondays, then Tuesdays with and Wednesdays & Thursdays as the heaviest ridership. Going forward they need to break out the days if they want understandable data.
Microsoft and Downtown Bellevue are regional employment centers. But if you are coming from Seattle then East Link is irrelevant right now. You take the bus right to work (or you drive). If you live on the East Side there are some combinations that likely attract riders, but not that many. For example there isn’t much point in driving to South Bellevue as most employers on the East Side have free parking (for their employees). There are plenty of buses that go to both places, so I don’t see a two-seat ride being especially useful. There are one-seat commuters (Bel-Red to Downtown Bellevue, Spring District to Microsoft) just not a lot of people. When Link gets to Downtown Redmond you will have more people commuting, but you will also have more people taking the train for other reasons (as Downtown Redmond has jobs and other attractions).
All of this changes when East Link gets across the lake. There are way more people who can take a one-seat ride to the East Side jobs. There are even more jobs in downtown Seattle, and plenty of people who can take one-seat rides there. But the two-seat rides increase dramatically. Likewise there are plenty of people (especially on the East Side) who will park and ride. Many of them do now (of course) but they will switch to using Link.
I’ve noticed it’s not uncommon for Saturday ridership to be highest on brand new rail lines; it’s people checking it out.
I finally made it to the starter line to see it. I left Issaquah around 8 am last Tuesday. I didn’t need to go anywhere and just wanted to ride the train. As usual at that hour getting to I-90 was congested, once on I-90 things flowed well, there was a backup at the 405 exit going north (and it will be backed up going south in the evening, something has to be done with that exit), and exiting onto Lake WA was easy.
My first impression was the station is HUGE. It’s like an airport terminal. There were around 50 cars in a huge parking garage. I parked near the other cars so my car was not vandalized. I got a little confused getting to the platform but it was my first time. I wonder how safe riders feel in such a cavernous and empty parking lot at night. No way my wife would walk into that empty garage at night (of course she won’t go into Seattle period).
The station is very clean and white. It looks brand new. Zero graffiti. No garbage. I was surprised at how high up I was. Lovely views mostly of green spaces.
Around 8-10 people were waiting for the train which was 5 minutes away. I enjoyed the wait because I wanted to check out the views and station. No one was wearing a suit. Mostly casual business attire. The 6 or so women waiting all waited together for the first train car. I got in the last train so I had a view out east.
The trip is pretty cool. I had never seen this part of Bellevue out east over 405 from an elevation. The thing that struck me is how tall buildings are to the west of the train and how short or industrial they are east of the train and 405.
The train is very smooth. But just as it gets up to speed it comes to a station. Virtually no one got on or off except at the downtown station. My train car had at most 1 or two riders the whole way.
The starter line struck me in comparison to Line 1 in Seattle from CID to U. District. The ELSL is elevated and bright, safe and clean, but really there is nothing at the stations except downtown Bellevue. I imagine the trip across the lake will be beautiful. In contrast, Line 1 is underground, dark and claustrophobic with many more riders who are definitely from a rougher cut. You definitely are more tense on Line 1 than the ELSL. The stations are dirty and pretty sketchy outside the stations on Line 1. You see nothing of Seattle. I thought how cool it would be to ride an elevated line in Seattle along Line 1. But at least when you get to a station like CID, University, Westlake, CHS, UW, U. Dist. you get “somewhere” once you climb out of the station. There literally is nothing at the stations along the ELSL except downtown Bellevue, and this is five years after East Link was supposed to open.
So for me the ride on the ELSL was way more pleasant than Line 1, but there isn’t anything along the ELSL. I would definitely recommend it to a tourist. If it had gone to Redmond I would have probably gotten off to see the new development in Redmond and how it compares to Issaquah since I haven’t been to Redmond in a while.
I could see taking it to Seattle, but I would drive to the S. Bellevue Station rather than taking a bus to catch the train. When it comes to Issaquah Link, I would definitely ride Link to Bellevue or Kirkland because Kirkland is way more vibrant than Redmond and the ride is much more pleasant than on a bus. The distance from Issaquah to Bellevue is pretty long so the train with not many stops will really zip along.
If downtown Seattle gets it mojo back taking Link from Issaquah to Seattle would be a hit I think because the elevated run including across the lake will be spectacular because you can drink booze and get an Uber from the station in Issaquah back to your home for not much. An Uber from Issaquah to Seattle is pretty steep unless you share it with several people but reasonable within Issaquah.
I can see why people in West Seattle want Link. I would be opposed if someone tried to stop Issaquah Link since we paid for it and it was promised in the levy.
” I wonder how safe riders feel in such a cavernous and empty parking lot at night.”
In my forty-five years of living there and traveling through and hearing from others, I’ve never heard even an inkling of the South Bellevue Way area or the P&R being unsafe. It’s middle-class people who use the P&R, and it’s pretty empty off-hours, but that’s it. When I’ve waited for a bus there at night occasionally, I’ve seen either nobody or one or two passengers.
The biggest crime problem my relatives say in Bellevue now is, thieves breaking into cars to steal Christmas presents, or stealing the cars or the catalytic converters.
@Issaquah: Newer parking garages have ceiling lights that turn on when they sense motion, so at night when you need to get to your car on a relatively empty floor, you can see all around you. The T-Mobile Park garage has this, and South Kirkland’s has this too. I wouldn’t worry about safety issues in South Bellevue’s garage, especially if they also have security cameras (I don’t know if they do).
I’d like to know what weekday versus weekend ridership was like on Link pre-pandemic, given how well used the trains were for sporting events and concerts. One Seahawk game probably gets as many riders as a large chunk of downtown office towers’ commuters on a weekday would get back then. And imagine how packed a fully built East Link would’ve been for those Taylor Swift concerts last year.
I’ve been to the South Bellevue Station and garage, and despite it being big and mostly empty, I wouldn’t tell anyone to avoid it, even in the evening. Also, every time I’ve been to a 2 Line station, I’ve seen multiple security personnel. At eastside transit centers, I almost never see security.
Mike, We are not talking about me. I was talking about my wife.
My wife was mugged in a parking garage. The person only stole her purse but it really freaked her out. Like every woman she has friends who have been sexually assaulted or threatened, and of course has had her share of being groped on the bus. According to studies one in two women feel unsafe walking alone at night.
She and her girlfriends took a course that the Issaquah police dept. offers women about safety, including safety in parking garages. The officers putting on the class take it VERY seriously, way more seriously than you do. So my wife always parks at a stall nearest the elevator although she prefers to park on the surface and carries an alarm and mace she holds whenever entering a parking garage.
The two biggest triggers are whether it is night and how empty the garage is, and whether it is underground. Even Lincoln Square. As I noted she won’t go into Seattle let alone a garage in Seattle let alone a transit garage.
When she pushes the key fob to open her SUV it goes off like a Christmas tree. They even make a purse with a pocket for a gun one of her friends uses after taking a CCL class (my wife is afraid of guns too) if she knows she will be going into a parking garage. If the garage is for public transit, even East Link, it only makes her more aware. We hear the news on the Eastside about crime on Link.
I am not going to change her, or mansplain her to not be afraid because the risk is low. The officers who put on the class she took told her the risk is high for a woman alone. Anyone who reads the local papers knows the risk of crime is high, especially at night. Better safe than sorry according to the officers, and better to avoid situations that contain risk. So that is what she does.
The problem is, if they did what your wife would have preferred, there would be too little capacity for rush hour commuters during the day (once the full 2 line opens). You can’t have both the capacity of a large garage and the environment of a surface lot.
I am always a bit creeped out by parking garages. Of course there is an obvious alternative: don’t use them. Just take a bus to the train (if you can’t walk to a station). You also call a cab if you are in a hurry (and the bus is slow and/or infrequent).
Saturday car traffic also tends to be the same or worse than Monday and Friday. Just more people out and about.
Mike Orr, just for the record, has there ever been a security concern raised on this forum that you didn’t downplay? I can only guess based on your name, but you sound like an able-bodied white middle aged male. Your experience is probably not reflective of the 50% of the population that is female. Nor Asian, nor elderly. And definitely not like that of my wife, who is all 3.
I’ll leave it to others to say whether they’ve heard of security concerns at South Bellevue P&R or in the south Bellevue Way area. My impression is the people who would attack an elderly Asian woman just aren’t there.
I go by the 50% rule: is it more than 50% likely that I’ll be assaulted at some location today? Or if I go there regularly, how often am I likely to have an incident? If the answer is less than once a year, or something every ten years, then I don’t think it’s worth avoiding or calling unsafe. Even if the street people downtown look intimidating, most of them wouldn’t attack you, some might under unusual circumstances, and the ones who would attack you every time are vanishingly rare. I realize other people feel differently, but when somebody says an area is unsafe because one person got attacked a year ago, or 20 people out of 10,000 are attacked every year, that seems like an overexageration or stirred up by the media.
50% chance you will be assaulted? Are you insane. Do you use the 50% rule when flying.
Most people I know use the 0% rule, lower if there is a chance you might be killed because you can only be murdered once.
You have to also consider how badly you need to go somewhere when assessing risk. My wife can easily avoid transit for the rest of her life. If she wants to go shopping or out she goes with me or a friend. Or takes Uber. Or goes someplace with surface parking like Bellevue Square or every business in Issaquah. Not many enclosed parking garages in Issaquah because women don’t like them.
She isn’t a weak woman. She works in the ER. She regularly sees stuff that would make us crap our pants.
I sometimes wonder how many men on this blog have wives. Hey honey, don’t worry, there is only a 50% chance you will be raped. To park in a park and ride to catch a train when she doesn’t like transit anyway and owns a car.
Why is walking across a parking lot at South Bellevue more a dangerous than walking across a parking lot in Issaquah? The crime rate in Issaquah isn’t exactly stellar either.
The bigger the garage level, the darker the place will feel unless one is on the roof.
The more empty a garage is, the more unsafe it will feel.
My advice for South Bellevue is to park on a higher floor closer to stairs. That way, you redue the walking time inside the garage — and someone on the platform is more likely to hear you if you call out.
If you feel vulnerable in public, I would ask the local police where to get coached in defensive strategies. Different people and situations require different actions. My standard initial response is to say and to appear to be in a hurry.
Most people I know use the 0% rule, lower if there is a chance you might be killed because you can only be murdered once.
If that were the case then they wouldn’t drive. That being said I don’t get the 50% thing. That seems to be very different than the rest of the paragraph, in which Mike wrote:
Or if I go there regularly, how often am I likely to have an incident? If the answer is less than once a year, or something every ten years, then I don’t think it’s worth avoiding or calling unsafe.
I think that is how people view driving. Yes, many people die on the roads on a regular basic, but the odds I will die are actually fairly low. Living an unhealthy lifestyle is far more dangerous (sometimes that goes along with driving, sometimes it doesn’t).
When discussing security when taking trips, you’re not talking about absolute security versus the security of going on the link or bus. You’re talking about the security versus taking a car. Every study that I’ve seen has shown people are an order of magnitude more safe taking Transit. This is true both during the ride itself which is a no brainer as well as getting to and from transit versus to and from a car. Turns out transit stops are well vetted, attended, often have security, and just more secure than dark empty parking lots.
It’s funny when someone tells me to be safe when I hop on a bus when I am 10 times safer than them taking their car. My response is typically… omg, you are driving? You are really taking your life in your hands.
Realizing this is a transit blog, this security question disguises a real issue… too many people are cowards and cannot stand to even meet their own neighbors. So they sit alone in their car isolated which brings on a heap of other personal emotional issues incl.uding feeding their own cowardice.
https://www.modeshift.com/is-public-transportation-safer-than-individual-transport/#:~:text=Owning%20a%20car%20and%20making,people%2C%20surveillance%2C%20and%20staff.
Very interesting, considering how Microsoft is such a weekday-only destination. There is very little reason to go to or from Redmond Tech station on a weekend unless you happen to live in one of the apartments within walking distance (or along a connecting bus).
Issaquah Resident – thank you for your comment, very well put. I get the distinct “vibe” that there are NO woman on this forum, and very few men married to woman or with small children. What folks like Mike just don’t seem to get is that most (maybe all?) women go through their entire teen-age to adult life with their threat sensors dialed on high any time that they are away from home. And it doesn’t matter whether the crime happened on transit, the simple fact that we are now in a society that allows (almost entirely male) predators to roam at will with little or no fear – so little fear that a pregnant Asian woman can be gunned down in her car. If she can’t be safe in 4000 pounds of metal, ain’t no way in hell she is getting on transit where she currently has ZERO protection (unless she has a CPL).
First of all there are women that are on this forum and some of the people have kids. Second of all you are talking in circles. People get killed in cars. Most often via another car but sometimes via a gun (as you mentioned). The risk of death while riding transit is much lower than it is for driving: https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics/deaths-by-transportation-mode/
@asdf2 — Yes, it will be interesting to see the numbers. Maybe Redmond Tech Station (Microsoft) has hardly anyone and people are just using it to get around (especially to Downtown Bellevue).
“the simple fact that we are now in a society that allows (almost entirely male) predators to roam at will with little or no fear”
I don’t know a single woman that hasn’t always felt that way, and that “now” is no worse than whatever idyllic time and place you might have at one time thought existed.
“There is very little reason to go to or from Redmond Tech station on a weekend unless you happen to live in one of the apartments within walking distance (or along a connecting bus).”
Redmond Tech has the most connecting bus routes besides Bellevue TC and South Bellevue, and the stops are right near the platform. If you’re taking the 249 to far east Bellevue, this is the most logical place to go to. It’s also a the place to transfer to the B if you’re continuing toward downtown Redmond. So maybe people are transferring.
True, but:
1) Hardly anybody rides the 249.
2) I not sure if the B line runs often enough to make Link->B (for DT Bellevue->DT Redmond trips) actually any faster than B all the way. You move faster through Overlake, only to sit there for 10 minutes and until the same B-line bus you could have gotten further back pulls on in.
Maybe during rush hour, when the B-line both runs more often than normal and more slowly than normal, then the connection is worth it.
Many people are a lot more bothered by being assaulted on public transportation than getting into a car accident, even if the former is rarer than the latter. It’s like how flying is far safer than virtually any other transportation mode, but a lot of people would much rather drive than fly because of ridiculous TSA lines, airline price gouging, fear of heights, and so on.
ST says that the 2 Line was missing from the performance tracker because the “data is being vetted for accuracy.” My bs dector is going off.
Maybe you should get your BS detector checked.
Have you incorporated the 2 Line into your trips to Bellevue yet? I know you said you would have to delay doing so. Let us know how it works out when you finally start taking the 2 Line, and if it’s an improvement over your old way of doing it.
I’ll be going in the next week or two. I wasn’t able to go in May or so far this month due to intense work projects.
As an infrequent rider, I have noticed a gradual increase in 2 Line ridership.
And don’t forget, the Eastrail NE 8th Street Bridge, aka the Wilburton Station Pedestrian Bridge, will open on Sunday, June 23rd.
If ST is basically hitting the low end of their ridership forecast in the very first month of operation, then we can be assured that the pre-service estimates are accurate. Congrats to ST.
And it should be noted that the first month is a very poor indicator of overall ridership. It takes time for people to learn about the new service and get comfortable using it as a transportation option. Ridership will only grow from these levels, and grow substantially.
And, if these numbers hold up, you can add another approx 5% to the ridership totals for Link. Good news.
Now maybe all the ST doubters on this blog can go back to complaining about escalators, or the quality of he PA system, or pigeon droppings, or maybe discussing gondolas. LOL.
Now on to the openings of LLE, RLE, full ELE, and FWLE. Link ridership is going to double in the coming years. Better get used to it, because this is what success looks like.
Just to be clear you were one of the biggest doubters of this proposal. You felt like they couldn’t do it without delaying Lynnwood Link. The rest of us felt like we should at least explore the idea. In this instance you were the one who doubted ST, not the rest of us.
You seem to believe that whatever Sound Transit is doing right now is perfect and they should not change course. Then when they do change course you claim that was what you wanted from the beginning. You are like a yes-man for Sound Transit. I gotta ask: Do you work for them?
At around 4,000 riders a day it is clear that opening early was worth it. The folks who made it happen (especially King County councilmember Balducci) deserve a lot of credit for pursuing this. A lot of people (including myself) criticize the board (for various reasons) but they deserve a lot of credit for this. So far as we know, the idea of opening this section early did not come from staff but from Balducci. Well done.
I expect a considerable increase when the station at Downtown Redmond is added.
Interestingly enough, if you look at the Metro Rider Dashboard it appears that RR B ridership actually went down slightly in May 2024 when compared to the previous month. This is interesting in part because in previous years RR B ridership actually increased slightly April to May.
This is undoubtably a direct result of riders switching from RR B to the faster and more reliable 2-Link. This trend will probably continue as 2-Link ridership continues to grow with time.
It should also be noted that at approx 4000 daily riders the ELSL is not too far off the approx 4600 riders that currently ride RR B. With continued slow growth in ELSL ridership it is likely that 2-Link ridership will exceed RR B ridership sometime before RLE opens.
And when RLE opens there will be a quantum jump in mode switching from RR B to 2-Link.
Good news all around.
It is interesting to see that it is already almost beating the B. It always seems to me like there are far fewer people on the 2, but data is of course better than anecdotes.
There are two destinations the B has that the 2 doesn’t: Crossroads and Downtown Redmond. Pretty soon there will only be one.
@Christopher Cramer,
Ya. It’s a bit surprising to see ELSL almost beating RR B so soon, but the B never really had very solid ridership anyhow. And this is pretty early data. We will have a much better idea of the relative impacts after a few more months of service on 2-Link.
And you are correct, when RLE extension opens to DT Redmond the impact to RR B should be much more substantial.
One problem when the Downtown Redmond Extension opens is the East Link Connections bus restructure won’t happen until the full 2 Line opens. The Redmond TC is about 1/5th of a mile away from the Downtown Redmond Station. Some routes get near the DRS, like the 545 and 250, but some routes like the B Line and 221 don’t. But, other than that, I agree that the opening of the RLE will be a big improvement for the line. But for more seamless bus/train transfers, people will have to wait for the big bus restructure.
@Sam,
Ya, I can understand not doing a large restructure for ELSL or for RLE, but it does seem like some small, targeted improvements could be made.
After all, we are talking buses here. It’s just not that hard to move a stop or two. After all, it’s one of the supposed advantages of buses.
Has there been discussion about simply moving the existing Redmond buses going to their TC a few blocks to the new Link station in opening day (rerouting rather than restructuring)? Waiting until full East Link opening seems silly, especially since there will now be at least a year gap between the two opening days.
Currently, there’re seven routes that go to the Redmond Transit Center: the frequent B, 250, and 545; and the infrequent 221, 224, 542, and 930.
Of these, the 250, 545, 224, and 930 currently go within a block of the station. A bus stop next to it should definitely be added, and maybe they should even be diverted from Redmond Way to Cleveland Street to bring them right up to the station entrance.
The B, 542, and 221 would be a little more difficult. Eventually the plan is to extend them, though – so I’m fine with doing that already if whatever infrastructure is available.
Hypothetical question for everyone. The Downtown Redmond Link Extension just opened. But you are at the Redmond TC. Your destination is the Redmond Technology Station/Microsoft area. How do you get there? The B Line? Or, take a bus (or walk) from the Redmond TC to Downtown Redmond Station to take the 2 Line?
When I did my station-area walk in February I found the station was a 5-10 minute walk from the transit center; I don’t remember exactly. So either the transit center needs to be moved or the bus routes modified to serve both the TC and the station. Otherwise buses can’t effectively extend Link’s reach.
I haven’t checked whether the East Link restructure does this, so let’s take a look.
The East subarea map is kind of hard to read there, but the line B PDF confirms it’s extended to the station. The 222, 223, 224, and 250 also serve it. The 269 serves Marymoor Village station. The 251 serves both stations.
The B and F RapidRide lines are the only ones that have worse-than-10-minute headway on weekdays. Getting the B Line’s frequency up to brand seems like it ought to be a priority. Matching headway with the 2 Line might help riders who transfer between the lines a lot.
That said, the only other Metro routes with 10-minute midday headway are the 7 and 36. The 44 and 60 have 12-minute midday headway. Every other route is 15 minutes or worse.
> But you are at the Redmond TC. Your destination is the Redmond Technology Station/Microsoft area. How do you get there? The B Line? Or, take a bus (or walk) from the Redmond TC to Downtown Redmond Station to take the 2 Line?
Honestly probably take the B line for the microsoft commons (west one). If it is the part east of 520 probably easier to use the light rail and then transfer to the microsoft shuttles at the Redmond technology center if farther on the east side (assuming for a microsoft employee)
I know you didn’t quite ask about it but for overlake village I’m not sure. the light rail would be much faster for it, but at the same time you’d then need to walk much farther on both ends.
“The B and F RapidRide lines are the only ones that have worse-than-10-minute headway on weekdays.”
Is that true? It keeps going up and down on individual lines. I thought most RapidRide lines were 15 minutes. Even if one goes up to 10 minutes, there’s no guarantee it will remain there more than a couple years.
The A, C, D, and H have 10-minute weekday midday headway. E is 7.5-minute headway. B and F are 15-minute headway. If the G-Line ends up worse than 7.5-minute-headway, it will be from the repeated streetcar mistake of over-promising frequency and under-delivering specialized fleet.
I and other B riders have been complaining about how slow it is afternoons, and how it takes a surprisingly long time from Crossroads to downtown Bellevue or Redmond. So that’s the latent demand for something faster that would switch when it can. Link isn’t suitable for many B trip pairs, but it can be suitable for some. And it creates new trip pairs that never had anything except coverage transit before Link.
Metro might not be able to speed up the B, but it can reduce average wait+travel time by 2.5 minutes by investing in frequency.
The B and East Link don’t really complement each other right now. East Link is no doubt cannibalizing some of the B ridership. There really isn’t much reason to take one then the other and they overlap quite a bit.
When East Link goes over the lake that will change. The B will be modified slightly to avoid excessive overlap (and increase coverage). This will also allow it to run straight (and faster). People will use the B more as a feeder bus (for trips to Seattle) as well.
If that’s the case, the B line stops at Wilburton Station better be moved closer and improved because that will become a major transfer point.
I took the 2 the other day and found out the hard way that the nearest southbound 249 stop is 3 blocks from Overlake Village Station. (I have coincidentally always connected at Redmond Tech Station up until now.) Luckily I didn’t miss my bus. Maybe they’re waiting for the whole line to be running before they reconfigure the stops around there, but I see no reason why they couldn’t just put a stop right in front of the station.
Ya. It seems like Metro could do a little more to integrate their legacy service with the new Link line. Obviously ELSL doesn’t warrant a full Eastside bus restructure, but certain small targeted changes seem very doable.
Metro makes small changes like this all the time. Why not here?
Being in proximity to overlake village station, I would love to use it more, but my trips involve either:
-connecting with the nearby 226 or 245, which take effort to reach
-biking to the station, which is fine if not for:
-commuting downtown at 6am, which the 2 line currently barely makes
-commuting back from seattle past 9:30, in which my only real option is to wait for the B line at redmond tech station to get
*somewhere* in the proximity of home.
-its often much quicker to bike to redmond tech station or Eastgate p&r, and avoid the 2 line altogether.
Side note: during one trip, I got off at wilburton station, expecting easy access to the 226 stop in front of overlake medical or 12th st ne. I ended up missing my bus.
I was curious to what several of us predicted last year. It’s inside this post:
https://seattletransitblog.com/2023/09/06/breaking-down-east-link-starter-line-ridership/
Many of us predicted between 3-4K for average weekday riders. Maybe some were more pessimistic than others but numerically we seemed closer than ST and their 6K forecast for the Line — at least in their first month.
It is just the first full month. We shall see how that changes over the summer. Will it grow as riders gravitate to it over time, or will it shrink because its novelty wears off like with a restaurant opening? Or maybe it will just stabilize.
I’ll be curious how many of those boardings are at the various stations. I’m paying attention to Downtown Bellevue and Redmond Technology stations to see when the data arrives. Other stations will have their own curious attractions. South Bellevue will be a particularly curious data point.
Finally, I will be curious which stations are barely used. I’m expecting BelRed and East Main at the bottom for 2024, noting that these stations will have good TOD nearby that has yet to open.
If y’all are curious here’s the bellevue construction map https://buildingbellevue.bellevuewa.gov/
that showcases where future development will be taking place. In a positive light most of them are along the east link rail corridor.
Well it’s about time I do hope that the light rail system continues to grow the area needs it.
@Mukibi,
The Light Rail system will continue to grow. In the next 2 years we will have at least 3 new extensions open: Lynnwood Link, Redmond Link, and full East Link. Nothing of that scale has ever happened before in this region. It’s going to completely change transit locally.
Also, Federal Way Link will open shortly after. That will be great too.
The mode wars are over. Link is a thing. Light Rail is working and is being expanded. There is no going back to 198O’s amber.
Nobody wants to go back to 1980s amber. For those who’ve forgotten or weren’t here, Metro routes were mostly half-hourly in Seattle, and hourly in the suburbs. Three quarters of the routes were peak expresses to downtown Seattle. Others were typically very long milk runs. The 550’s predecessors went through Beaux Arts or Enatai, had three stops on Mercer Island, and went the Rainier/Dearborn way to downtown. There was no such thing as all-day expresses to Tacoma, Lynnwood, Issaquah, or Redmond. There was no rail; nothing better than Metro’s coverage-like service. The highways were all here, so cars had even more of an advantage relative to transit, two or three times more.
The issue is not Link vs no Link, or current/long-term bus service vs 1980s service. It’s about some variations in a minority of Link’s network, whether Metro’s current service hours could be more productive with some restructures, and how big Metro’s/ST’s future bus expansions should be.
Thanks in part to COVID, work-from-home has become the preferred mode of many.
I hope ridership at the older stations catches up to what it was in the Before Times. We are not there yet, and crazy ideas like Gov. Hochul banning masks on MTA aren’t helping.
In the next 2 years we will have at least 3 new extensions open: Lynnwood Link, Redmond Link, and full East Link. Nothing of that scale has ever happened before in this region. It’s going to completely change transit locally.
Do you really think the expansion is a bigger deal than service to the UW? Really? In terms of how people view transit that was huge. Our transit system in the past was hub and spoke, with the hub being downtown. A metro should not be designed for that — express buses and commuter rail are adequate if not ideal for that. A metro is really about the various stops along the way. You can see this in most systems around the world. At every stop there are lots of people getting on and off. In contrast if you ride a commuter style bus (like the old 41) from downtown there will be people getting on at every stop downtown and then very few board once it gets to Northgate. With the expansion to the north we broke that pattern. I’m not saying there weren’t people who took the train from say, Othello to Beacon Hill, but relatively few. For the most part people viewed Link the same way they viewed the bus system: great for getting downtown, otherwise not that good.
As Link expanded northward it changed all that. The time savings to go to places like Capitol Hill and the UW was huge AND there are a lot of people making that trip. You really can see the pattern. At a stop like Capitol Hill there are as many people getting on the train as getting off. Same with the UW and U-District. Even Roosevelt has some of that. The pattern would be stronger if there were more stations, but it is clearly there.
The expansions have some of that, but not a lot. There are no major destinations to the north of Northgate or south of Angle Lake. Some of the riders in the suburbs (to the north especially) get better access to the same sort of trips enjoyed by those at Northgate (quick trips to places like Roosevelt, UW and Capitol Hill) but that is basically just an expansion (and a relatively small one at that).
East Link is more complicated. Within the East Side it does the same sort of thing. But as we’ve seen, there aren’t a lot of people making trips from say Bel-Red to Downtown Bellevue, despite the fact that it is dramatically faster. I expect those numbers to go up as Link gets to Redmond, but I still don’t expect them to be close to what exists in the north end. Most of the ridership will be for trips across the lake. For some of the destinations it will be quite similar to what the buses offer. For a handful (Wilburton, Spring and BelRed) it will be dramatically better. But at best it will offer the same sort of thing that exists at the north end of Seattle.
Lazarus, you keep saying the mode wars are over. What mode wars? Link light rail is one mode, buses are another. Both are necessary. Both have equally important, but different, roles to play. It seems like in your head, Link defeated Metro in an imaginary mode war. Link now reigns supreme, with Metro, if needed at all, is now relegated to providing feeder service to Link stations. This battle or war is all in your head. There is no war, and no mode has “won.”
I asked you this question before, but you didn’t answer, so I’ll try asking it again. Let’s say King County can only keep one mode, the public bus network, or the light rail network, including the future full 2 Line, and FWE. Which mode would provide the county with a more functional overall public transit system?
Well said, Sam.
“Let’s say King County can only keep one mode”
Why? That doesn’t correspond to any reasonable or likely network. It’s like an abstract homework question.
“Let’s say King County can only keep one mode”
Why? That doesn’t correspond to any reasonable or likely network. It’s like an abstract homework question.
Sure, but it is a reasonable followup given the comment by Lazarus. In New York City, for example, you can very easily make the case that the subway system is more important than the buses, even though the buses carry millions of people every day. In Vancouver you would say the opposite, even though SkyTrain carries around half a million (since the buses carry more). Of course in both instances you want both — you need both — for a good transit system, but it is still an interesting question given what Lazarus has written.
lol I’d say Lazarus is somewhat right that there was a “war” but it wasn’t quite rail versus buses.
Back in 2014 the original plans were always to build light rail and buses but it changed drastically in the 2016 proposal. (And the lynnwood link and federal way link extensions from avenue to freeway alignment)
Renton to woodinville sounder this was replaced with the stride freeway brt. The issaquah express buses were changed to light rail. Most of the other link at grade on avenue or streetcar proposals were dropped.
Namely the vision of link switched from avenue light rail with some tunnels and freeway buses. To switching to link on predominantly freeway alignments and avenues now brt only mostly.
For another example the west Seattle to Ballard was originally an at grade 2 car light rail on 15th or up market that has now been switched to a deep bore tunnel urban subway — however costs have ballooned and construction has not started so it’s a bit premature to say this vision has “won”
On paper, all five openings are due in the next two years — not just three.
The April Progress reports state full East Link will have revenue service on December 5, 2025. Then Federal Way Link is scheduled to have service April 9, 2026. 130th St is scheduled to open on June 9, 2026 in the same report.
ST has also indicated that the East Link opening may be delayed further.
The next two openings in the next 12 months — Lynnwood and Redmond — are reasonably spaced as opening dates. However, the opening of Federal Way likely will require access to the East OMF before it can happen (as early as June 6, 2025 with simulated full East Link service beginning September 6, 2025).. 130th “testing” will likely be creating a phantom stop on in-service trains with the platforms closed off.
Once Lynnwood Link opens or until Redmond opens, I expect ST to update the dates in a way that makes sense for them. But I see the most critical date is the date that East OMF trains can finally cross into Seattle. Everything subsequent pivots off that.m date.
Just by the looks of things 130th seems quite far along. It was designed so that they wouldn’t have to retrofit the station. This means the line won’t be closed down to add the station. I don’t think they will have to do any special testing (unlike an extension). They have to build the escalators, elevators and stairs, but that is about it. I think it will open “early” (not with the rest of Lynnwood Link like it should have been, but earlier than the current schedule).
@Al S,
I didn’t include Federal Way Link in the 2-year window because I don’t think it will be open within 2 years.
Currently FWLE is scheduled to open in April of 2026. Any delay is likely to push the opening date to the end of summer or fall of 2026, which is more than 2 years from now. And any delay in full ELE is likely to delay FWLE too.
As per not including 130th St Station, its opening is a nothing burger. ST originally estimated that 130th would add zero (0!) net riders to the system. So it really isn’t a major event that will markedly change transit regionally.
The 148th St Ped Bridge will probably have a bigger impact, and I didn’t include that either.
“As per not including 130th St Station, its opening is a nothing burger. ST originally estimated that 130th would add zero (0!) net riders to the system. So it really isn’t a major event that will markedly change transit regionally.”
For the hundredth time, 130th is the closest we can get to stations in Lake City and Bitter Lake. It doesn’t matter if it add zero net riders; it adds two whole urban villages to the system, and that’s tens of thousands of people each that will have better access to Link. That’s important in itself. It also gives future residents more choices which villages they can live in and still have good access to transit.
And ST’s zero net riders prediction is probably flawed. It can’t count potential upzones that haven’t been approved yet. Residents may be more enthusiastic about transit than ST’s models suggest, especially in Seattle villages. Future residents may choose Pinehurst, Lake City, or Bitter Lake because of its 130th Link access more than ST’s models predict. In any case, the city can make it happen if it gets more aggressive in zoning decisions and encourages a wider variety of retail/non-residential destinations in Lake City and Bitter Lake, to give people more of a reason to go there or live there.
Ha, that’s so funny. Lynnwood Link will be the biggest thing ever! It will completely change transit for the region. Except that one station that is remarkably similar to every other station. That station won’t have any riders.
Rainier Beach Station is still a nothing-Impossible-burger. But I don’t hear anyone saying it should not have been built.
What do you all think about the low operating speeds on the line?
* The Spring Blvd section which is capped at 25 mph feels like punishing transit unnecessarily, while cars go by faster (regardless of aspirational speed limit). Track speed must be closer to 35 mph, and I’d like to see that.
* The elevated sections cap out at 45 mph, while 1 Line usually hits 55 mph and generally this is the design speed of Link. The track speed on straight elevated sections should indeed be at least 55 mph.
I’d really like to see the higher speeds implemented.
In fact, I’d go even further. The Siemens S700 (and the Kinki Sharyo trains too) are specced up to 65 mph for other cities. Even our Siemens trains list an allowable speed of up to 65 mph. I’d love to see the longest stretches on the system (TIBS to RBS; CHS to UWS and from the East Channel Bridge just East of Mercer Island to Judkins Park) be upgraded for operation at that speed.
The argument typically made against this is that given stop spacing, the benefit is minimal, however the benefit does add up on a long commute, likely to the tune of 5-10 minutes. And that matters to a transit commuter.
I haven’t gotten to try the 2 Line yet, but count me as skeptical of the safety of speeding up trains on at-grade segments where other modes cross.
It’s already 35 mph in Seattle. Meanwhile Bellevue has crossing arms that go down when the train passes which makes these level crossings much safer. And legally the train can go any speed, e.g. Amtrak has level crossings at 110 mph.
It sucks, but the line was designed in such a way that in many places, the speed can’t be increased. For example, consider all the curves and close stations between Spring District and East Main. The train is either slowing for a curve or slowing for a station. Consider the at-grade section between BelRed and NE 20th. There’s no way ST wants its trains going faster through there. There’s only a couple of places where it can pick up a little speed, and it’s already doing that. So we’re stuck forever with low operating speeds along large sections of the line.
It will be interesting to see how Link’s shift to a $3 flat fare will impact 2-Line ridership.
As most of you know, I am wholeheartedly welcoming the change.
A friend of mine recently got a warning for tapping off and then failing to tap back on, despite still being within the 2-hour transfer window. They did not take it well.
My challenge to a warning I got several years ago never even got a response from ST.
The double-tap-on-exit probably reduced false positives significantly. My math had false positives around a quarter of all warnings before that.
The end of tap-off on Link should further reduce false positives.
But even then, I look forward to ST some day, as a matter of policy, honoring clear-and-obvious proof of full pre-payment.
Does anyone know the answer to this question? Let’s someone has an E-purse card. If they tap and ride Link, then get off, then board an ST Express bus and tap, are they charged for the bus ride, or since it’s the same transit agency, is a free transfer included, even though it’s different modes?
It’s a free transfer within the alotted time since the first tap and only charges you more if you tap off to a higher fare (i.e. Sounder).
ORCA has free transfers between all participating agencies and services. I use it for Metro, CT, PT, Link, ST Express, Sounder, and the Seattle Streetcars. I think it works for microtransit (Metro Flex, PT Runner), and I’m not sure about the monorail. Probably not the state ferries. My internet is going up and down like a yo-yo today so I can’t check the agency sites but you can. Metro routes are the only ones still offering non-ORCA transfers to other Metro routes, so all other transfers require ORCA.
The first time you tap, it starts a 2-hour transfer window. If you board a higher-priced service during that time, you’re charged the difference and a new 2-hour window starts.
This is to confirm Washington State Ferries does not count towards any transfers, nor are transfers included gluing to the ferries.
Can we talk about consistency of using the word “Downtown” in a station name? It’s currently “Downtown Redmond” but “Bellevue Downtown” and “Federal Way Downtown”.
And that’s not even mentioning that Lynnwood gets “City Center” instead and no additional word is currently added to Mercer Island and Everett stations even though they will be adjacent to Downtowns.
It seems too late to change the official station names except Everett. But going forward, it’s a nuance that we should be aware of.
And we are still waiting for station numbers. I was surprised that East Link starter line opened without station numbers already posted. Maybe ST has quietly killed the concept.
I complained about it during all the naming decisions. The word “downtown” is redundant; the city name alone indicates the main downtown station, like Berkeley and North Berkeley, Hayward and South Hayward, and El Cerrito and El Cerrito del Norte. So it would make more sense to have Bellevue, Redmond, and Lynnwood. But different cities have different preferences for vanity reasons.
I agree. It is silly to have the word “downtown” or “city center” in your name, as a city station without any modification is clearly downtown (or the city center). It is all marketing. I lived a few blocks from the future “Downtown City Center” station, and no one called the area “downtown” or the center of anything. It is a suburb that sprawls this way and that. There is no obvious center, and there never has been. I get why civic leaders want to change the way people view the area, but again, that is just marketing.
In general ST is just way too verbose with the names. Either use “Shoreline South” or “148th” not both. At least Mountlake Terrace is just going to be called “Mountlake Terrace” and at this point the 130th station will be called just that (as well it should be).
Ross, it’s why I prefer “Central” over “Center”. The former indicates where in the city limits it is, while the latter implies that there is a there there. Almost every station should have a there there, so it actually seems kind of redundant to me.
But Mike’s point is that terms like “Central” are redundant. Which is more central: “Berkeley” or “North Berkeley”? I’m going to guess “Berkeley”. A proper noun without modification implies the main one. For example there are several Annapurna mountains (as well as a range, a village, etc.). But if you say you “climbed Annapurna” then it can be assumed you climbed the main one. (You are also kind of crazy — the fatality rate on that mountain is horrible).
It’s actually El Cerrito Plaza, not just El Cerrito. It’s named for the shopping center across the street.
The name of the station is “Downtown Berkeley” rather than just “Berkeley” by the way, Ross.
Notably, Ashby Station is also in Berkeley. — but almost at the city limits.,
“It’s actually El Cerrito Plaza, not just El Cerrito.”
I thought I remembered it being El Cerrito in the 80s and 90s, but maybe it had the Plaza then. West Oakland was definitely Oakland West; I remember it from the audio announcements and map. I’m glad it was renamed.
“The name of the station is “Downtown Berkeley””
OK, so Berkeley was renamed too.
It was always El Cerrito Plaza.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Cerrito_Plaza_station
The web says that 1995 was the year that Berkeley Station became Downtown Berkeley Station.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downtown_Berkeley_station
You didn’t mention Concord and North Concord. That naming evolved because North Concord wasn’t envisioned as a station for a few decades.
Note too that it’s Pittsburg Center to distinguish it from Pittsburg/ Bay Point. Bay Point was originally called West Pittsburg but the area got a name change. It’s probably for the best as Pittsburg/ West Pittburg would be a terrible station name!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bay_Area_Rapid_Transit_stations
“You didn’t mention Concord and North Concord. That naming evolved because North Concord wasn’t envisioned as a station for a few decades.”
I’ve never been that far on the yellow line so I haven’t paid much attention to the extensions beyond Concord, as the terminus was when I first encountered BART. I once tried to go to Concord to see what the far part of the line is like, but by the time I got to Orinda it had already taken half an hour so I turned around.
This goes back to how ST is run by local politicians, and therefore has a tendency to defer to local municipalities. It doesn’t have to, but it does.
I also remember when I complained East Main was a dumb name, and the comment section told me that it was “just a placeholder name.”
Also, notice how transit centers aren’t named downtown this or that? It’s not Downtown Bellevue TC, or Downtown Kirkland TC. It’s just Bellevue TC and Kirkland TC.
It was a placeholder name, but ST goes through a process for each station of asking for names and choosing a final name. We can’t help what final names ST chooses. Over time people might start calling it the East Main neighborhood to go with the station.
Does Downtown go at the beginning or end of a station name? ST uses before and after.
I have been a bit amazed that “Central” has not yet emerged in a station name. Downtowns are typically considered central business districts. “Central” seems to me a better word describing where it’s located in a city with multiple stations. For example, I think Central Federal Way, Central Redmond or Central Lynnwood would have been good station names. I also agree with Mike that cities with just one station should use only the city name.
“Central business district” sounds like a real-estate marketing term.
“Lynnwood City Center” doesn’t make any sense now because there’s only one Lynnwood station. Where should the station be? Downtown of course. Where do people get off if they’re going to any part of Lynnwood? The only Lynnwood station, of course. It’s like when ST used to have “Station” in the station names audio announcements. Where do trains stop? At stations of course. Likewise, serving a city/neighborhood means serving its center. If somebody is looking for something Lynnwood and gets off at a station called “Lynnwood” by mistake, they’ll be downtown and where they probably wanted to go. Or even with not, it’s where the most transfers are to get to where they want to be, or people they can ask to find their way.
Even if the only Lynnwood station is outside downtown Lynnwood, like at a P&R or the edge of the city, it’s still where people going to any part of Lynnwood should get off, so “Lynnwood” is appropriate.
ST3 will have more Lynnwood stations, but none will have “Lynnwood” in the name. So “Lynnwood Downtown” would still be silly.
Or do we need “Mountlake Terrace City Center” station too, just in case people aren’t sure if it’s for downtown? What would they do? Go to a non-Mountlake Terrace station because they’re not sure of “Mountlake Terrace” is the city center or the closest station to it?
Agreed Mike. That is the other aspect of it. Not only is this often marketing related, but they think people won’t have any idea how to get there without a lengthy explanation of what is there. It would be like naming the U-District Station “U-District/Upper Campus/Burke Museum”. All true of course, but completely unnecessary. I sure as hell don’t want to see 130th Station be called “Bitter Lake/Pinehurst/Lake City Connector Station” even though most people will use it for that. Or consider what happens before a Sounder game. Thousands of people use the CID station, even though the other station is the one called “Stadium”.
We don’t need a full description of a station — only a simple moniker to differentiate it from the other stations. People will figure it out.
“We don’t need a full description of a station — only a simple moniker to differentiate it from the other stations. People will figure it out.”
How about Sasquatch Station? Then hold a competition to design the appropriate station art work! That would seem to be a great differentiator and a succinct name. It may even add ridership from art spectators!
I’m fully expecting the tribe to push renaming East Tacoma Station the Emerald Queen Station when the naming topic emerges. The station motif can be a triple fortune dragon! Lol
“2 Line ridership data is being vetted for accuracy and to ensure expediency for future reporting”
Someone done eff’d up counting, whether it be the metrics used or just plain adding up. Several times before the Starter Line opened, I commented that it would barely break 2000 daily riders. I wonder if the current numbers of ~3900 are preliminary and will be corrected in July…. or that’s solid and accurate?