A long-awaited ORCA feature is finally available to (some) transit riders: Open Payments. Riders of the RapidRide G line are now able to use common contactless payment methods such as tap-enabled credit cards and digital wallets on smartphones to pay fare at ORCA readers installed along the line. The feature has been in the works for ORCA for years, with a full rollout expected this spring after this “soft launch”.
As of today, riders are able to pay fare (full-price adult fares only) by tapping their credit or debit cards, or digital devices like phones and watches. The system will accept taps from the most common tap-enabled bank cards or smart devices, including iPhones. Unfortunately, ORCA cardholders are still unable to load their ORCA card into digital wallets on iPhones.
During the soft launch, riders who tap to pay with a physical or digital bank card will not get free transfers between RapidRide G and other transit services, but can request a paper transfer to board other Metro routes. Once tap-to-pay expands across Metro and to other transit services, transfers will be accepted between these systems.
However, there are other limitations which are not expected to change in the near future: each rider must use their own payment method, either a physical bank card or digital wallet. Riders cannot pay for multiple riders using a single card or device. Users are also warned to avoid tapping with their entire wallet as there may be issues if there are multiple tap-enabled cards (such as a bank card and an ORCA card) stacked in the wallet.
When fare inspectors check for payment, riders who tapped to pay will be required to share the last four digits of the payment card they used to pay fare (and sometimes the first six digits as well).
Users will be able to review their history of fares paid via tap-to-pay on a new website: https://www.myorca.com/contactless-history. Fare payments are searchable by the first 6 and last 4 digits of the card used to pay, or with a bank statement code. If a tap-to-pay method is declined, the card will not be able to used to pay fare again until the issue is resolved. After the problem is corrected, the card will be charged for the previously-unpaid fare when it is used to pay fare again, resulting in two charges.
The inability to add Orca to an Apple Wallet is truly ridiculous at this point. What is the hold-up!?
There hasn’t been a clear explanation but it has something to do with Apple being very restrictive with how Wallet works and apparently it’s not simple to get the ORCA system to work with it. I assume they’ve been focused on getting tap to pay working, but they know that getting ORCA cards in iPhones is a highly desired feature.
What’s wild is HOP works in Apple Wallet and this was also built by INIT, so the vendor has accomplished this previously.
I suspect that if the problem were simple, it would have been resolved by now. Their announcement acknowledged the high interest in using iPhones so perhaps getting ORCA cards in Apple Wallet will be their next project after tap-to-pay is rolled out.
It just seems like having a digital version of transit card in Apple Wallet is different thing from allow debit/credit tapping although it feels like a package deal.
Many more US agencies have already accepted on-board debit/credit payment, but very few of them also let you add their transit cards to Apple Wallet.
Famously NYC didn’t roll out anything with MetroCard when they introduced credit/debit tapping in 2019. When physical OMNY card was finally out in 2022, it was only meant to replace MetroCard and couldn’t be added to any digital wallet. The only reason to have a next-gen physical transit card was to give cash users an option rather than anything that would make thing more convenient. Before physical OMNY card was introduced, reduced fare payer had already been able to claimed discount by using their credit card as long as the card was registered in OMNY. Also all the ride tracking feature can be made possible by credit card tapping if the payment card is registered in OMNY. You can still use the unregistered card to pay if you don’t have a OMNY account.
It is said that OMNY is in talk with Apple regarding the feature, but as of now New Yorkers still couldn’t add transit card to apple wallet.
Even if ORCA can be added to Apple Wallet some day, I doubt special passes can be added, so there is little meaning for that in my opinion. To regular fare payer who wants to pay with an iPhone, it is safer to just pay with a transit-mode-enabled debit/credit card in Apple Wallet.
Agree that this the thing to be solved by ORCA in Apple Wallet: employer passes and commuter passes. Anyone who uses either of them, and I’m assuming it is a non-trivial percentage of overall ridership, won’t have immediate use for Open Payments.
Yep. I want my orca card in my apple wallet so I can use my free transit. Until that happens, no reason.
Any word on fare capping?
It’s so silly to have to manually choose to have a day pass added to your digital wallet on android, otherwise you can get charged more than $6 in a day if you accidentally ride 3 times outside of 2-hour transfer windows.
Without fare capping, credit card tap to pay is going to result in a lot of overcharging.
How do you see fare capping working on Sounder?
In my experience, I have never seen a commuter rail system – domestically or internationally – use fare capping or a flat rate. For the Sounder, I wonder 1) what’s the percentage of riders ending their commutes in downtown and 2) how much do fares make up for Sounder revenue?
Last summer, I was helping a set of German tourists navigate Westlake station. They were under the adamant impression they had to tap off after each usage of Link. I then had to explain the difference between Link and Sounder and our complicated fare system & payment method.
Theoretically I don’t see why it can’t work like a regular pass does. The cap pays your first $3, and you pay the surcharge beyond that. If you haven’t reached the cap when you tap into Sounder, you will by the end of the day, and then maybe ST can retroactively adjust the Sounder fare (although that may require custom software), and then charge your credit card once at the end of the day like it said it would do.
Jordan, off the top of my head some commuter rail systems that offer fare capping include:
– most National Rail services in London
– DART and IE in Dublin
– GO Transit in Toronto
– Sydney Trains
– V/Line and Metro Trains Melbourne
– RTD in Denver, though maybe a cheat as this is generally a flat-fare system across all modes
I’d personally like to see the monthly pass slightly reduced. It should be a no-brainer for somewhat frequent riders to buy a monthly pass. Once someone holds a monthly pass, they don’t have to think about paying to use transit when the opportunity comes up.
My understanding is that fare collection policies are set by individual agencies, so Metro or ST would need to adopt a fare capping policy before other ORCA-accepting agencies follow suit.
I expect the various agencies feel cost of slightly reduced fare income outweighs the benefit of slightly increased ridership or improved rider experience. The current socioeconomic environment has ST considering fare gates to boost payment rates while bus operators are discouraged from enforcing fares for their own safety. Fare capping is nice but since it’s a policy (not a technology), it’s hard to predict when we might get it and it’s not really in ORCA’s purview as a provider of a regional fare payment system.
I agree with fare capping as an alternate to the pass system.
London has a fare capping system, and there you also have to tap off because you pay differently depending on the zones you travel.
So… If the Brits can figure it out, then why can’t we? It seems like it would be easier here where we don’t have to worry about tapping off anymore.
It’s all under Transport for London, for one thing. It doesn’t have several agencies with different administrative preferences and different financial situations needing to agree on a common policy. They have gotten far in the past few years — the common $3 fare on ST and Metro (except Sounder), while CT/PT/ET keep their lower fares.
And London is a larger and more transit-minded city, so there’s more political motivation for it.
Mike, it’s not entirely all under TfL. Most of the National Rail services in London area are not operated or contracted by TfL (only the Overground and Elizabeth Line are managed by TfL, but operated by Arriva and GTS respetively) and are instead operated by a mix of private companies or UK Department for Transport. There are National Rail services that stop at TfL-zoned stations but are not part of the TfL fares (eg. LNER and Avanti West Coast), services within the TfL fare zones that don’t participate in fare capping (Southeastern High Speed), and services that follow the same zone boundaries as TfL but charge higher fares (Thameslink, Southern, and Southeastern). Plus, you have zones where Oyster (ORCA) and contactless pay-as-you-go are valid, and TfL-administered zones where only contactless is valid but not Oyster. It’s a very complex system that’s taken over two decades to get where it is now, and it’s still evolving. Seattle can and should learn from London’s system, but it’s not a simple task
“Seattle can and should learn from London’s system, but it’s not a simple task”
It’s also not that hard. If Seattle was as up to speed as Nashville it would be an epic step forward.. Just like adding service, Seattle/King Co is just way behind the curve because ‘we’re special”.
What happens if you have both an Orca card and a credit card registered on your Google Wallet? Will it take the Orca card by default? If not, do you have to select your Orca card on the Google Wallet screen? That’d be a huge inconvenience.
Probably, unless Google Wallet has a feature similar to Apple Wallet called “Express Transit”. Apple Wallet allows you to specifically designate a card for fast-access at transit card readers, plus a back payment method.
With just credit cards for my every day purchases, I’ll go to my wallet and bring up the specific credit card I wanna use. I’d assume it would be the same with ORCA v. credit card.
From the “Remove Card From Wallet” tab of https://info.myorca.com/g-line/#helpfulresources: “If you have both an ORCA card and a credit or debit card in Google Wallet™, you must select the form of payment you wish to use on your smart device before tapping”
I may have spoken too soon. According to Gemini, Google Wallet is already designed to prioritize a transit card over a credit card when the phone is tapped on a transit payment reader. I guess I’ll see. I sure hope Gemini is right.
I had this happen in Chicago when tapping to pay using my phone. Rather than using my default credit card in Google Wallet, it brought up an old Ventra card which once upon a time I had added for a transit pass. Manually selecting the credit card before tapping or deleting the Ventra card was the solution.
When my credit card got a chip, the ORCA readers started saying rejecting the tap and saying “One card at a time, please”. I folded a piece of foil over the credit card in my wallet, and now the reader taps the ORCA card happily.
When I got a new debit card for a secondary account a couple months ago, I forgot to cover it, so I was afraid the reader might have charged that card full fare instead of charging the pass on my ORCA card, but when I looked at my bank’s transaction history, it hadn’t charged that card.
I think if you are sticking to digital wallet, that’s usually less of an issue. The bigger issue is for those who are used to tap their physical wallet full of cards.
That’s why I think it is always better to tap using smartphone. They work even when battery dead as long as the “express transit” mode is properly enabled.
Its a bummer none of the dlreduced fare program users can access this. Also in google wallet if you add your orca card i think the physical orca card is deactivated so the apple fan clib might be surprised.
Deactivating the physical card happens with all virtual card conversions, not just Apple. ST is apparently afraid you’ll give the physical card to somebody else and they’ll double up on your transfer periods or pass. So therefore nobody can have a shared physical/virtual card. I personally don’t see the point in virtual cards or paying by credit card, so I just keep using my physical ORCA card.
Deactivation of the physical card is why I refuse to switch to a virtual card.
It’s not worth the risk of one day being stuck somewhere, unable to get home, because my phone runs out of battery, or some internal Google issue is preventing access to my account.
I’m surprised more people don’t think about how their phone might not work when they need to tap into transit or show their boarding pass at an airline gate.
I always have a backup orca card in my wallet, but it’s just more convenient to tap my phone.
If my phone malfunctions when boarding an airline gate, the gate agent can look me up and print me another boarding pass, so I still get on the plane. Not so with transit.
And, yes, the fact that phones malfunction is a frequent blind spot in the transportation industry, and the tech industry in general, as everybody thought that phone apps were the way of the future, while physical credit cards and cash were relics of the past. Look at Uber, Lyft, and Lime for examples, Even in the private car world, there are parking garages now that require smartphones to pay for parking, and EV charging stations that require smartphones to put electricity into your car.
Moving forward, I think the problem is only going to get worse. China, I’ve read, has already reached the point where, if your phone dies, you basically can’t pay for anything until the phone is fixed.
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Not sure for how this works out in open payment via debit/credit card, but for digital transit card, your phone doesn’t need to be turned on to tap on/off. So as long as your phone is not lost, you can always pay with a very dead phone.
The moment you add transit card to your phone, the NFC chip info of your mobile device was registered in transit card system. The card reader is reading the NFC chip of your phone not anything more than that.
This is very different airport boarding pass and many digital payment system in China. In China, the bigger problem is that people prefer using QR code to pay for transit because that comes with more discount, but that’s a very lousy way of getting through busy subway fare gate.
>> I’m surprised more people don’t think about how their phone might not work…
To me, it’s a risk-vs-benefit assessment. I’ve been a smartphone user since 2008, and my device has become unusable exactly twice while I was out and about. If I wanted absolutely zero chance of that happening, I’d carry my physical cards, but then I’d run the risk of losing my wallet, which may be greater than having a non-functional smartphone.
To me, it’s a risk-vs-benefit assessment. I’ve been a smartphone user since 2008, and my device has become unusable exactly twice while I was out and about.
Yeah, and you can always pay cash. But then again, if you only have a phone you might not have cash. I always figure cash will get me out of a jam (as it has in the past) but I can understand why someone would assume a phone is good enough.
It is largely a generational thing. Dai is young. I’m not. I resist carrying more stuff and I still don’t view a phone as essential (although I carry it more often now). I’m also forgetful. I generally remember to carry a phone now but I sometimes forget to charge it. I stick my ORCA card in my wallet and it is always there (along with cash, ID and a credit card). I always remember my wallet but I know people who are the opposite (they sometimes forget their wallet but always remember their phone). I doubt I will ever use Google Pay but I’ve said that about a lot of things. It would certainly be handy on transit while traveling.
I use a chain wallet. That limits the styles available but ensures my wallet or keys won’t accidentally fall out or somebody nips my wallet without me noticing it. I also leave them and my phone in the pockets when I’m not wearing the pants to minimize the chance of forgetting one of them. This greatly helps avoid stress and worry I’d otherwise have.
Very happy to see payment flexibility, but it is time to ditch the fare inspectors on trains and use more economical fare gates like just about everywhere else in America and the planet that matters. The gates will always work when the inspectors are not and they don’t require healthcare and don’t go on strike. A win win for the taxpayers and something badly needed in an age of upcoming deficits and cuts.
ditch the fare inspectors on trains and use more economical fare gates like just about everywhere else in America and the planet that matters.
So places like Germany, Canada and San Fransisco don’t matter? What a weird take.
The gates will always work when the inspectors are not
You still need security to ensure that people don’t jump over the gates. You’ve basically just moved enforcement from the trains themselves to the stations. It ends up costing more because you have to install all the gates.
What? San Francisco has fare gates Ross. BART obviously but even the muni subway has them even though you don’t need a ticket to go through the gates.
What do you mean “Canada”? Our neighbor to the north that gets 4x the ridership of Seattle has fare gates.
The buses of Muni are proof-of-payment. Calgary and Edmonton have proof of payment. The idea that proof-of-payment is some crazy idea that we came up on our own is just not true. Nor is the idea that it would save money. Most likely it would just end up costing us money.
ST is studying fare gates and hopes to start building a pilot project later this year. Lucky you! It still depends on the study, which isn’t finished.
Most likely the pilot will be one or two DSTT stations. The Rainier Valley surface stations will be the hardest to retrofit, and that’s one of the things the study needs to study, whether fare gates will be feasible there, or whether ST will just skip installing them in those stations. ST doesn’t want people walking along the tracks to get around the fare gates and then getting hit by a train.
FWIW, I think the fare gate strategy most likely to actually pay for itself would never involve installing gates at every station—it would probably involve gates at the highest ridership stations that require a tap to open on both sides. This conveniently leaves the Rainier Valley out of the picture, while still charging people traveling from there to Westlake, Capitol Hill, Sea-Tac, etc.
Im with Mike on this one. For tme I just hink it’s easier to remember to bring my physical orca card but I still have cable and zero streaming subscriptions so I guess I’m a luddite at heart.
It would be so simple to just issue paper RFI tickets like transit agencys that have their act together. Go to Portland and buy a day pass, or multiple passes if you’re traveling with a group using a credit card. Get your ticket(s) from the machine, done. There’s going to be tens of thousands of people this summer wondering how a “high tech” city can be so backwater.
Link has that at the TVMs, a Link-only day pass on a cardboard card. There are signs encouraging ballgame attendees to get one for their round trip if they don’t have ORCA.
And you can pay for it with a credit card? And buy more than one with the same card? If so then why go backwards with the system they are rolling out on the G line. And if you can buy a paper day pass why is it only good on Link and not Metro, or at least ST buses… geez. Dumb and dumber.
> why go backwards with the system
It’s not going backwards, it’s just another payment method. There are plenty of situations where someone might find themselves without cash and without an ORCA card and only wanting to pay one trip at a time.
Oh, it looks like you CAN get an all-agency day pass at a TVM now. It’s $6 and requires an ORCA card.
https://support.myorca.com/hc/en-us/articles/10743519362317-Visitor-s-Guide-to-Using-Public-Transit-in-the-Seattle-area
This is separate from the Link-only day pass, which is also $6 but comes on cardboard and doesn’t require ORCA. You get it from another part of the TVM menus.
https://www.soundtransit.org/ride-with-us/how-to-pay/fares/ticket-machines
Yeah, it is going backwards. Metro/ST is on this loonie orbit where every few years they “simplify”” fares. And then they incrementally change things, with no obvious benefit. After about 7 years they again throw it all out with the “simplify” mantra. This is another example where they almost had it right and screwed up yet again. It’s a case of too many cooks in the kitchen. The ST board structure has to go; or you just say on the merry go round.
“Oh, it looks like you CAN get an all-agency day pass at a TVM now. It’s $6 and requires an ORCA card…..”
Case in point; Transit nerds have a hard time figuring it out. I tried what should be a simple inquiry. Should I buy a monthly pass or pay daily for LINK when the bridge finally opens. GAWD, how hard can it be to navigate the various websites to try and figure out; how much a monthly pass is and what does it cover vs paying a daily fare. And I was only looking at riding LINK with no transfers. The website(s) are abysmal.
The first-6-last-4 fare inspection thing might be broken before it starts.
I checked my Apple Wallet to confirm something I thought was true: you can’t actually pull up a complete credit card number in the app. Apple Wallet and other digital wallets create entirely new “virtual” credit card numbers when you register a physical credit card, and then transact against those
If Apple Wallet uses the “virtual” credit card number (and it usually does) when transacting with the card readers, then you, dear user, quite literally cannot access to the first 6 digits and thus have no ability to produce them to a fare inspector when asked — you can’t display them under any circumstance, or so it appears.
I expect them to run into this one pretty quickly so I’m not too worried about it in the long term but still….I’d have hoped someone had run into this in testing.
You still get the last four of the card number in Apple Wallet. It seems to me the expectation to provide the first 6 digits will be rare. I don’t know how the transactions work on the backend, but I assume the last 4 and first 6 digits (not the whole 16-digit card number) are shared with the payment database somehow.
As a tourist, while it was a pleasure to be able to pay for transit in the Netherlands with a credit card, and a complete pain in the ass to buy a card that was confusing as heck to load in Paris, I wouldn’t want to be giving Visa and Mastercard that 3% every tap as a local.
I wonder what the agencies processing charges are for running their own payment system? I’d be shocked if ST and Metro can process payments for less. And when I use my Amazon VISA I get cash back (credit actually to spend on the Amazon site). Plus I’ve got a nicely itemized list at the end of the month.
As they say, nobody rides for free.
“It’s great to see new payment options like tap‑to‑pay being tested small innovations like this really improve the overall transit and parking experience. It also made me reflect on how much parking has changed from manual processes to smarter, tech‑based systems. I found this comparison helpful in that context: https://medium.com/@Mobisoft.Infotech/manual-parking-process-compared-with-smart-parking-management, it highlights some practical differences in how things work.”