[UPDATE 5:00pm 3/1: PT’s website indicates that service interruptions will be worse than previously thought, lasting several days.]
[UPDATE 6:13am – Pierce Transit’s website announces that “Emergency fueling efforts were successful and all Pierce Transit service is operating on schedule.” Very nicely done on a logistically difficult operation.]
[UPDATE 7:50pm – video from KING5 above]
[UPDATE from Martin 7:31pm: PT Spokesman Lind Simonsen says the explosion occurred at 5:05pm in the building that houses the natural gas compressors for the fueling station. The damage was limited to that building. All PT staff are accounted for and there are no injuries.
The site has not yet cooled down enough to be properly inspected. PT has a contingency plan to fuel PT and ST buses that run on CNG, but there are likely to be service disruptions in the morning. Check the PT website for service updates, possibly tonight but certainly by 5:30am or so tomorrow.]
Just after 5pm today, a natural gas explosion occurred at a bus barn behind the Pierce Transit administration building. From what we can gather, it looks like it might have occurred while a bus using compressed natural gas was being refueled. According to a radio report I heard shortly before 6, at least one bus is a total loss but thankfully there are no injuries. We don’t know much more than what local media is reporting right now. We’ll post any major updates so stay tuned.
I wonder how many similar incidents have occurred nation wide with CNG fleets? Of course even diesel has safety issues as the truck that blew up on I-5 this morning proves. Electricity doesn’t explode and if there is a fire at least there’s no stored source of chemical energy nearby to make a bad thing worse.
The driver is in the I-5 incident is quoted as saying that when he got out, the transmission was fully engulfed; it was likely the hydraulic fluid that caught fire, not diesel. And the explosions were almost certainly from the truck’s tires, not the fuel tanks. The diesel was probably a minor factor (if that) in the fire and the explosions.
And electricity most certainly can explode in arc flashes, and according to NIOSH “5 to 10 arc flash explosions occur in electric equipment everyday in the United States”. It’s probably not an issue for those operating buses or cars, but for workers at substations that provide the power to, say, the ETB grid it’s almost certainly a risk, as it is anywhere you’re dealing with massive amounts of energy.
I-5 truck fire causes severe backup Monday morning
This was reported by both KOMO and KIRO radio yesterday who had crews at the scene and given as the reason the surface streets under I-5 were closed.
KOMO, KIRO, and KING make no reference to the fuel tanks in their written stories, and KIRO explicitly mentions tires exploding. I don’t buy the physics of the diesel tanks exploding, and a hastily-written 6-line story and live reporting aren’t going to convince me.
I do, at least, agree with you that CNG seems like a rather risky fuel to use in hunks of metal with ignition sources moving 60 miles an hour with a known tendency to collide with other hunks of metal with ignition sources.
What do you think batteries are other than large stores of chemical energy? And batteries (lithium in particular) don’t have a sterling safety record, especially when being charged, either… Pretty much any way you store a LARGE amount of potential energy is going to have some impressive failure modes.
Well yes but I wasn’t thinking of battery powered vehicles in terms of freight movement and mass transit but grid connected technology. Hauling around the mass to cover the entire route is just plain stupid. I do believe that in the case of ETBs an off wire capability is important but it’s not nearly the scale or risk of CNG or other fossil fuel powered vehicles even if they’re a hybrid. And, although something like the battery in a Prius does represent a significant source of stored chemical energy it doesn’t create a bomb like CNG, gasoline or even diesel do. Yes, they are an environmental disposal problem (and other problems) but I was thinking primarily of grid connected options.
But you can’t really run ETBs on say I-5 can you?
So we will always need at least batteries, if not other fuel sources for the Express bus system.
The overhead ETB network presumably has fuses that would blow to prevent a prolonged massive current delivery.
For safety, I’ll take diesel over gasoline or CNG any day of the week. Just ask a sailor.
I recall drivers saying that ETBs were used on Aurora back in the day, but those speeds aren’t like I-5.
There have been a couple incidents in NY, mostly at Queens Surface Transit Corp Garages. I seem to recall a situation around 1999 where a couple of RTS’s got burned up in a fire at the CNG fueling station. In 2005 this incident happend as well:
http://www.firehouse.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70623
@ 17:27
QUEENS: +EXPLOSION+ BOX 4895 26 AVE & 128 ST / FLASH FIRE-EXPLOSION AT THE QUEENS SURFACE TRANSIT BUS DEPOT / INVOLVES THE NAT GAS REFUELIN G DRYING STATION / USING 2 + 2 / NO INJ / MNS3-IAP
@ 17:31
QUEENS: *ALL-HANDS* 7-5-4895 aof 128-15 28th AVE x 128 ST. D-14 REPTS; USING A/H’S FOR A FIRE IN A CNG GAS DRYING MACHINE AT THE QUEENS SURFACE BUS LINES GARAGE. 1 LINE STRETCHED AS A PRECAUTION. S/C HM-1 & HM BC. L-130 FAST TK, MNS3 [MNS342]
@ 17:34
QUEENS: *ALL-HANDS* 7-5-4895 aof 128-15 28th AVE x 128 ST. D-14 REPTS: USING A/H’S FOR A FIRE IN AN EXTERIOR CNG GAS DRYING MACHINE AT THE QUUENS SURFACE BUS LINES GARAGE. FIRE IS PWH MNS3 [MNS342]
probably fake
I’m just curious, how fast can the ETB’s go, and the slut? If there was no traffic in the way of either of these?
~45 mph for the SLUT trams. For trolleys it depends on how bumpy and curvy the road is, and a the quality of the overhead suspension system, but it’s probably about the same speed. ETBs are best for urban areas with more stops and lower speeds.
About 35mph is the maximum speed that our current trolley fleet appears to be able to achieve. I suspect the Bredas can go faster but haven’t driven them anywhere I can safely/legally “open them up”.
ETBs used to run on Aurora!
And, IIRC, the Vancouver ETBs can get up some speed when crossing the bridges over False Creek.
The Bredas might’ve been able to go even faster back when they were on 750 VDC instead of 600.
PT Riders, Heads up starting Monday: http://piercetransit.org/CNG/downloads/CNG_RiderAlert_3-3-11.pdf
This is related to the CNG Fire