The Swift Orange Line BRT launched on Saturday. I tried it out Sunday afternoon with my friend in north Lynnwood, who lives northwest of Ash Way P&R. The Orange Line is a limited-stop east-west bus route between Edmonds College, Highway 99, Lynnwood city center, Alderwood Mall, Ash Way P&R, Mill Creek, and McClollum Park. It runs every 10-12 minutes weekdays, and every 20 minutes weekends and evenings. Swift is Snohomish County’s version of BRT, running frequently on arterials RapidRide, but stopping only every mile like Link, some ST Express routes (512, 550), or the upcoming Stride BRT.
(Map by Community Transit. A larger version is in the link at the top of the article.)
The Orange Line joins two existing Swift lines in Snohomish County. The Blue Line runs southwest from Everett to Aurora Village. The Green Line runs southeast from the Everett Industrial Center to Canyon Park. Community Transit is building a few other Swift lines and extensions. The next ones will be a Gold Line north from Everett Station to Smokey Point, a short Blue Line extension south to the future Shoreline North/185th Link station, and a Green Line extension southeast to UW Bothell. [Correction: The Gold Line will not go to Lynnwood.[
Transfers: Orange-Green at three stations in Mill Creek. Orange-Blue at 196th & Highway 99. Orange-512 at Lynnwood Transit Center or Ash Way P&R.
My friend was skeptical of the Orange Line at first because it still wouldn’t address her biggest problem: the last two miles to her house, and the hourly bus that goes only halfway to it. But after riding the Orange Line on Sunday she said it will be very useful to get to central Lynnwood, and it opens up travel to to Mill Creek and McCollum Park, which she’d rarely been to because there wasn’t good east-west bus service on 164th.
I took Link from Seattle and transferred to the 512 at Northgate around noon. The 512 also runs every 20 minutes on Sundays, so I had a 10-minute wait. It took a speedy 20 minutes to get to Ash Way P&R. The 512 feels more luxurious than King/Pierce ST Express buses, and reminded me of taking long-distance trips on Greyhound.
The Orange station is on the street adjacent to Ash Way P&R, one station for both directions. To get from the 512 stop inside the P&R, you cross the wide bus driveway, then go on a new sidewalk to the street. On Saturday that sidewalk was closed and unfinished, but on Sunday it was open. There’s no crosswalk across the bus driveway so you have to treat it like shared space. My friend was afraid it might be illegal to cross the driveway, but I had no patience for that when there’s no other way to get between the stops without going out of your way to cross another street twice to/from a sidewalk at the northern edge, that was in any case still closed and unfinished. So the agencies should paint a crosswalk across the bus driveway the shortest distance between the BRT station and the regional bus stops.
This Orange station and several others have a new next-arrival display similar to ST’s new series at CID Station, although not identical. It has three rows for the next three buses. The stations have an ORCA reader and a new kind of ticket kiosk, but the ticket kiosks weren’t turned on yet.
We took the Orange Line east to the eastern terminus. Martha Lake looked beautiful. Neither of us had seen it before due to the previous skeletal bus service. In Mill Creek the Orange and Green Lines share three stations, with retail resembling mini big box stores.
The eastern terminus is McClollum Park P&R, which is adjacent to the same-name park. Walking west from the station you go through a large round lawn (officially an athletic field) to the woods beyond. There’s a paved path around the lawn. The woods feel like the dirt forest trails in the interior of Lincoln Park, Longfellow Creek, or Carkeek Park. A stream runs north-south through it, and another stream comes from the west and joins at a T. To get across the north-south stream you have to go to the northwest corner of the lawn circle.
We then took the Orange Line the other way to the western end, Edmonds College. We stopped there at Mod Pizza, then went east back to Ash Way P&R and went our separate ways. A fare inspector checked our ORCA cards along the way. On the first segment east we were the only ones on the bus. On each of the other two segments some ten people accumulated, and another ten got on or off at different points. That’s good for the second day of the route, and on Easter Sunday.
It takes half an hour to get from Ash Way P&R to Edmonds College. The route traveled the speed limit except for a congested patch on 164th. The route detours and the surrounding land uses will disappoint King County urbanists. The line detours to get to Ash Way P&R and to Lynnwood Station, further than RapidRide F at TIB. The north-south segment on 36th is blocks of single-family houses. That’s between Swamp Creek P&R and Alderwood Mall, so on the way between Ash Way and Lynnwood city center. There’ s substantial lowrise density along several parts of the line, but it’s “transit-adjacent development” instead of “transit-oriented development”, meaning it’s car-oriented with parking in front. Swift doesn’t continue west to downtown Edmonds or east to Silver First, so other routes have to do that and overlap with it. Still, they’re the local shadow in the overlap, which is needed anyway given Swift’s 1-mile mile station spacing. But even though Swift doesn’t go all the way east and west, it does go several miles both east and west of Ash Way P&R or Lynnwood Transit center, serving all the densest areas between Edmonds College and Mill Creek.
All these flaws should make a rapid BRT line questionable, but Swift can’t help the surrounding land uses or the location of the regional stations; it’s either Swift or nothing. Even with all its flaws, Swift Orange is substantially more frequent and faster to go east-west in Southwest Snohomish County than any other transit alternative.
My friend and I decided to go this summer to McCollum Park again for a picnic and a longer walk, and also to visit Martha Lake and Scriber Creek Park. I’ve been to Scriber Creek Park twice in the past few decades; it’s a wooded wetland oasis with a swamp and a boardwalk. It’s currently closed for renovation, but when it reopens it should be within walking distance of the Lynnwood Link station with a trail between them.
“The north-south segment on 36th is blocks of single-family houses.”
This is perhaps the biggest flaw of the route. CT insisted on routing the Orange line along 36th Ave instead of the Alderwood Mall Blvd. This routing not only is much longer but takes away service from the east side of the mall, which is where alot of the area’s retailers are located: Costco, Target, Khols..not to mention there are more stores and clearer entrances on the east side as well. I think CT missed the mark big-time on the mall routing.
It’ll also be interesting to see where the Link station will end up. If ST chooses the west side, then the mistake of the Orange line’s routing will be erased.
@Jordan,
“ It’ll also be interesting to see where the Link station will end up.”
Link will go on the east side of the mall. I suspect that is exactly why CT decided to serve the west side of the mall with Swift Orange.
Because it makes more sense to spread the BRT service around a bit, as opposed to putting BRT exactly under Link. I.e., complement Link with periodic transfer points, but don’t put BRT exactly under Link as a competitor.
The other advantage of going up 33rd is that you can provide direct service to Buffalo Wild Wings and the Red Robin! This is suburbia after all.
I suspect ST will favor the west side of the mall in order to activate land use policy more effectively. There is a lot of redevelopment planned within the mall footprint and to the north/northwest.
Also, the new route 166 activated last Saturday serves the east side of the mall with 30-minute all day frequency, as mentioned below. CT is saying in public meetings they’ll monitoring for frequency additions after Link opens and the pattern of movements with the revised network takes shape.
“Because it makes more sense to spread the BRT service around a bit, as opposed to putting BRT exactly under Link.”
Especially when the BRT is limited-stop. Link is a limited-stop service; it doesn’t need another one in the same corridor. It needs a local shadow. A limited-stop bus corridor should serve some other transit market.
STB hive: does the CT network provide enough service to downtown Edmonds? The orange line ends to the east. Downtown Edmonds has a tight street grid, significant multifamily housing, a ferry route, and baby north Sounder.
There are two routes that serve downtown Edmonds: the 130 and 166. Each operate every 30 minutes and both start/end at the ferry. The 130 travels along 5th Ave, SR104 and connects to Aurora Village (then zig zags its way to Lynnwood Station). The 166 travels along 3rd Ave and then 196th St, eventually connecting to Lynnwood Station and provides shadow service for the Orange Line.
It’s decent service as a lot of downtown Edmonds are seniors who ride irregularly. It’s also tough to connect to the ferry because it runs at odd and irregular intervals. So a transfer can be smooth or end up waiting 30 minutes.
Don’t forget the 102 that operates along Main St and 212th St.
The new Route 102 looks like the way to go. Apart from the diversion to serve the Edmonds park and ride lot, it is a straight shot between Lynnwood TC and downtown Edmonds/ferries/Amtrak. It is half hourly and not timed to the ferries, which is a bit annoying but doable. It looks like the idea is for it to combine with the 130 for 15 minute departures from Edmonds going to Link (either MLT or Lynnwood station).
Extending swift orange west to downtown edmonds could make sense (taking over route 102) along main street.
https://www.communitytransit.org/docs/default-source/mappdfs/systemmappdfs/mapsystem.pdf
> Downtown Edmonds has a tight street grid, significant multifamily housing, a ferry route, and baby north Sounder.
That being said, edmonds has structured all of their density along aurora and edmonds way. It’s unsurprising CT will place the buses where the density is. It’s true there is some multifamily housing but it is hard to build anymore.
Most of the surrounding zoning downtown edmonds is 6000 sq ft single family lots. And then even the multifamily zoning lots require 1500 sq ft per unit — higher requirements than Seattle’s townhouses sometimes. Some multi family zoning is even set at 2400 sq ft lot area per unit, practically the same as Seattle’s single family zoning.
https://cdnsm5-hosted.civiclive.com/UserFiles/Servers/Server_16494932/File/Services/Maps%20&%20GIS/Maps/Zoning2024_36x56.pdf (Edmonds zoning map 2024)
The summer service change will add a new 909 express between the ferry dock and MLT Link station sync’d to the ferry schedule and operating peak only.
Unfortunately, the ferries have become so unreliable that syncing a bus schedule to ferry schedule is nearly pointless. Ferry passengers would be better served with an orange line that simply extended to downtown Edmonds with an untimed connection every 15 minutes.
I’d like to see the Orange extended to downtown Edmonds eventually.
That would be great. Apparently the arterial grid and geography present some challenges for artics operating at BRT intervals with BRT stations. 196th gets really tight going down through the park, likewise Main just doesn’t’ really have the cross section needed. Those things could be addressed — for a cost.
thank you.
does the CT network provide enough service to downtown Edmonds?
I don’t think so, but the area is challenging. Older studies showed some promise for serving the area. Here is an analysis that included it as “Corridor 10” (on page 55). This is basically the new 166. So part of the route is turned into Swift, while the other part gets buses every 30 minutes. The analysis pointed out the issues to the east, so it is no surprise that the route doesn’t go that far east, but it is a bit odd that the Orange route doesn’t continue to Downtown Edmonds.
Ironically, part of the issue is the ferry. The 909 will be timed with the ferry. Unfortunately that particular ferry (unlike the one to Mukilteo) does not have a clock-face schedule. Thus it runs every 50 minutes or so (depending on the season). This makes it difficult to work with. Not only is it hard to keep track of the schedule, but it is hard to complement it with another bus.
Another problem is that demand is split between the various corridors, with none of them being that bad, and none of them being excellent. 196th (SR 527) is the most straightforward route, and would connect the quickest to the college (and everything east of it). But there is very little between 76th and Downtown Edmonds. The 102 goes down Main Street which gets you more of Edmonds and more apartments along the way (on 212th) but that means skipping the college. One issue with both of these routes is that in terms of density, Downtown Edmonds is more north-south than east-west. The 909 does an excellent job of going through the heart of the area. There are a few destinations and apartments along SR 104 and if nothing else it is fairly fast. It would be the fastest way to connect to Seattle if it went to 185th, but of course it doesn’t. It actually backtracks on SR 99 to work its way over to Mountlake Terrace. That leaves the 130, which is more of a coverage route even though it runs more often than the 909 (go figure).
I don’t think there is an easy solution. Downtown Edmonds is a good anchor, but none of the corridors are really strong. I think this is the nature of Snohomish County. Various destinations are spread out, and not really “on the way”. The exception is SR 99, which explains why the first Swift was so successful, and other Swift lines may pale in comparison.
I’m not really sold on the Swift concept (which should be no surprise). It may evolve into something really useful but at this point it isn’t clear that it is getting you a lot. It seems like you have a lot of infrequent buses and than an odd mix of frequent “BRT” buses that aren’t forming much of a cohesive network. It doesn’t seem very efficient. This explains why there are four buses that go to Downtown Edmonds, but at best they run every half hour.
I think trying to time buses to match a ferry schedule is a mistake because the ferry system does such a poor job following their own schedules. The only way to transfer from ferry to bus reliably without a long wait is for the bus to just run frequently.
I personally feel like 2 bus routes serving downtown Edmonds should be enough. The orange line should be one, the 130 should be the other. The 909 and orange line running in parallel is a lot of duplication, which CT should avoid.
I disagree with two routes serving downtown Edmonds. There are basically four corridors from downtown Edmonds:
1. 196th St SW – now served by Route 166
2. Main St/212th St SW – now served by Route 102
3. 220th St SW – no longer served by bus to Edmonds but had service a long time ago
4. Edmonds Way – now served by Routes 130 (to Westgate) and 416
Keeping the service on 196th and Edmonds Way would make a great distance between east-west service (approximately a three mile distance). That is a long ways.
There is a lot of density building up along 212th St SW, and 220th St SW serves the Regence group and the business on Cherry Hill in Mountlake Terrace.
What you’re saying would certainly be ideal. The problem is resources are finite. If you run 4 routes, then each route can only run half as often as if you have two. In practice, this tradeoff comes down to 4 hourly routes vs. 2 half-hourly routes.
I suppose if you had 4 routes, but staggered the schedule so that least a trip from downtown Edmonds to some Link station (but you don’t care which) would result in a bus every 15 minutes. But, in practice, trying to stagger it that way would likely mess up connections in other parts of the route and do more harm than good. So, you end up with the current mess, where three buses all leave downtown Edmonds at the same time, followed by none for the next hour.
Most of the corridors are worth covering. The tricky part is frequency. I think it is worthwhile to have at least one 15-minute bus to Edmonds. Otherwise riders trying to get to Edmonds aren’t sure which bus to take (especially if they go to different areas).
I think a lot of the problems are to the east, not the west. There is a lot of overlap. Overlap can be good in that it can create a spine where it is needed, but otherwise it is just waste. For example the 166 follows the Orange Line for much of the way. Perhaps it could be truncated at both ends (Ash Way in the east and either the college or Lynnwood TC to the west). Riders would then transfer to Swift Orange. A better alternative is to somehow combine it with another route. For example the western end could be combined with the 120, while the eastern end could be combined with the 119. That would leave the piece in between Ash Way and Lynnwood TC to be covered by the 117 and the Orange Line.
With that in mind here are some ideas (when I suggest truncating it might involve combining with a different route):
1) 196th St. SW (route 166). I would split it as mentioned. I would probably leave the western part as a stand-alone line ending at Lynnwood TC. I would have it dogleg to 200th on 68th so it gets closer to the college. At that point it might make sense to just combine with the Orange Line. This might create an awkward out-and-back to the college (similar to the out-and-back to Ash Way Park and Ride) but the detour for the through-riders would be a small price to pay for the big increase in frequency.
2) Main Street/212th (route 102). Seems like a decent route. It makes a little dip south to get close to Swedish Edmonds (to better connect to the Blue Line) but that seems essential.
3) 4th/SR 104 (route 909). I would give up on timing this with the ferry. I would also send it to 185th, leaving the 130 to cover that part of Mountlake Terrace). I would have the 909 stop at 200th, 192nd and 185th (along Aurora). 200th serves as the connection to the Blue Line and 185th connects to the 348. 192nd serves an area that is awkward for Metro to serve but likely to get a lot of riders.
4) Main/100th (route 130). I would keep this as planned.
There are savings here, but not enough to get great frequency (especially since the 909 runs every 50 minutes and I want to run it more often). Tough to make changes beyond this point as every corridor seems worthy.
Here is one way to do it though: Start by getting rid of the western part of the 166. So basically the 166 just goes from Silver Firs to Ash Way (perhaps combining with another route). I would have the 102 dogleg up to the college the way the 114 does (212th/72nd/208th/68th/200th) to Lynnwood TC. I think that is the most productive route between Downtown Edmonds and Lynnwood TC. The 114 would then be shifted to take over that part of the 102. That opens up the possibility of avoiding the awkward back-and-forth of the 102; instead the new 114 would do this: https://maps.app.goo.gl/UayYAEFxyPDP8B71A.
That might be enough savings to run one bus every 15 minutes (and the other buses every half hour). Hard to say what is the best option for the 15 minute bus. The modified 909 serves Downtown Edmonds really well, and picks off some important spots. On the other hand, the modified 102 runs by a college, high school and a lot of apartments while connecting to the main transit center for that part of Snohomish County. I see the 130 as a coverage bus (with service every half hour) and then flip a coin for which of the other two gets 15 minute service.
I think the 909 is an experiment to test the ferry-to-Link market with a fairly fast (albeit indirect) limited stop connection. There is merit in incentivizing Jefferson & Kitsap County users to leave their cars behind. I would expect to see CT continue to tinker with that service as the rail market matures.
BRT is a tougher nut to crack. 196th and Main just don’t have the cross-sections to handle the operation or the infrastructure. Capital investment could change this, but I’m not sure the citizens of Edmonds would be up for that kind of project.
@another engineer,
Are you suggesting that there are real world engineering constraints on what can, and can’t, be run on existing streets and ROW’s?
And likewise that there might be funding constraints on what can be build and/or redesigned? Because that sort of takes the fun out of it.
Right. Both arterials are two-lane cross sections with narrow lanes, tight turns, uncontrolled intersections and sporadic sidewalk conditions. Swift, like RapidRide, is meant to operate with at least 50% of the right of way secured by BAT lanes, HOV lanes, slip lanes or similar. Creating the conditions for reliable operations between downtown Edmonds and the college would require significant investment, ROW acquisition, widening and intersection modifications. I think that kind of investment would be worthwhile to get fast, 10-minute service going east-west. But it’s non-trivial, it’s a big, programmatic set of upgrades.
Fyi, I think y’all have slightly incorrect view of the current frequency. It’s generally faster from edmonds to use the 102 and 166 in many cases — even to aurora village transit center that the 130 reaches.
Route 130 is predominantly hourly, it only runs half-hourly frequency during peak times.
Route 166 and 102 do run half hourly all day.
All three routes run on “clockface scheduling”* or at least try to.
Route 102 is a 20~30 minute route or 40 (rounded to 60) minutes round trip and has two (three) busses for half-hourly frequency.
Route 130 is a 30~40 minute route one way or 60~80 minutes round trip and only has two buses for hourly frequency.
Route 166 is a 60 minute route one way or 120 minutes round trip. It has 6 buses running on it for half-hourly frequency.
* The clockface scheduling and traffic buffer means when doing the bus to frequency calculation there’s a buffer. For instance the route 130 leaves on the 20 minute mark from lynnwood transit center, gets to edmonds at a variable time, then gets back to lynnwood transit center at the 5 minute mark. Then it waits for a 15 minute break to the next run. https://www.communitytransit.org/route/130/0/table
Generally I agree with you ross. Should extend the orange line as either route 166 or 102 (probably with half or quarter mile frequency).
@another engineer,
Real world constraints strike again! No fun.
And big upgrades usually require even bigger budgets. And big budgets aren’t always supported by the local populace and/or the Feds. Again, reality is no fun.
But the 909 seems like a rational first step for tying Edmonds DT to Link. And with MTS station straddling the street, with bus stops directly under the Link platform, the bus-to-Link transfer ought to be pretty good.
> BRT is a tougher nut to crack. 196th and Main just don’t have the cross-sections to handle the operation or the infrastructure. Capital investment could change this, but I’m not sure the citizens of Edmonds would be up for that kind of project
> Are you suggesting that there are real world engineering constraints on what can, and can’t, be run on existing streets and ROW’s?
@ another engineer / Lazarus
Given the route currently has half-hourly frequency, for transit I think just adding 15 minute or even 20 minute frequency would be a lot better. I don’t think we (if I can assume a bit for the others) were talking about bus lanes or if so probably just some transit queue jumps at best.
> Right. Both arterials are two-lane cross sections with narrow lanes, tight turns, uncontrolled intersections and sporadic sidewalk conditions. Swift, like RapidRide, is meant to operate with at least 50% of the right of way secured by BAT lanes, HOV lanes, slip lanes or similar.
Not that I am against bus lanes, but the swift orange does not have bus lanes outside of the existing ones on aurora for swift blue and a short section on 196 within lynnwood.
@WL,
Swift is the closest thing this region has to real BRT. Is it perfect? No, of course not. But it is a vast improvement over some of the other so-called BRT systems in the area.
And one of the great things about Swift Orange is its direct connection to Link at LTC, and the opening of that system just got announced: Lynnwood Link will officially open on August 30th!
The Swift Blue connection to Lynnwood Link won’t be available until the bus restructures occur two weeks later. Meaning you will have to wait until Sept 14th to access Light Rail directly using Swift Blue.
Finally something to talk about. Progress!
> Swift is the closest thing this region has to real BRT. Is it perfect? No, of course not. But it is a vast improvement over some of the other so-called BRT systems in the area.
Uhhh I’m not against swift?
I guess to clarify a bit, I meant we don’t need to expand the road of 196 to extend the swift orange to edmonds that “another engineer” was talking about.
Fyi, I think y’all have slightly incorrect view of the current frequency.
I’m basing all of my comments on future frequency (https://www.communitytransit.org/transitchanges). I also use midday weekday as the standard. I realize that ignores some significant differences, but it makes it simpler. Thus the 102, 130, 166 will be every half hour.
The 909 is the odd one out. I get the value (as another engineer put it) to tying the ferry to an express bus. I think it works out great for Mukilteo and the 117. I’m less sure about the 909. Part of the problem is the frequency (50 minutes) whereas the Mukilteo ferry runs every half hour. Thus folks in Mukilteo along the way get a solid level of service. If Downtown Mukilteo was bigger (like Downtown Edmonds) you could run a bus opposite the ferry for 15 minute service to town. In contrast the 909 runs through more of Downtown Edmonds than any other bus, and yet it runs *less* frequently than the 130 (running on a much weaker corridor). Then there is the eastern tail. It backtracks to get to Mountlake Terrace. If you are coming from or headed to Seattle this will feel awkward, to say the least. Wouldn’t it be faster to just go to 185th? Should the bus be making all of the regular stops? It doesn’t feel like that much of an express. Overall it just like it is trying to do too many things.
I feel like you should just run a true express — with very limited stops, kind of like … Swift, between the terminal and the station at 185th. This would run infrequently and be timed with the ferry. It wouldn’t go on 5th through Downtown Edmonds but would stay on the highway, making a handful of stops before connecting to Link. A different bus would run on 5th — a bus running more often.
@asdf
I just said there are four basic corridors out of Edmonds. One of those doesn’t have service the entire length. There’s a reason the 119 turns on 76th Ave W and there is no service on the corridor west of 76th Ave W.
“ I also use midday weekday as the standard.”
Yeah this is important to understand. Unless someone takes a standard office job, just having transit at only peak frequencies isn’t good enough for making housing choices. And as work from home and flexible work hours get applied to those jobs more and more, that niche shrinks ( seen in Sounder ridership stats).
Plus agencies typically add more trains or buses at peak hours primarily because of overcrowding. If there isn’t crowding, the agency will not add frequency beyond what it is during the midday.
So I agree that we should default to midday in general.
“…which she’d rarely been to because there wasn’t good east-west bus service on 164th.”
“Neither of us had seen it before due to the previous skeletal bus service.”
I wouldn’t describe it as skeletal or not good prior to the introduction of the Orange Line. 164th St had 15 minute service on weekdays and 30 minute service on Saturdays where every other bus went to McCollum Park. I will concede that the service on Sundays may have been skeletal as there was only hourly service with no buses going to McCollum Park.
> It takes half an hour to get from Ash Way P&R to Edmonds College. The route traveled the speed limit except for a congested patch on 164th…. The line detours to get to Ash Way P&R and to Lynnwood Station, further than RapidRide F at TIB
Fyi there’s a future project to extend those direct access ramps east (currently only west) as well as adding southbound exiting ramps. So it’d allow the swift orange line to have a slightly faster detour.
I-5 (164th Street SW Texas T) – Mill Creek (85 million): “This project will improve the direct access ramp at Ash Way Park & Ride by providing a new connection to the east over I-5 for transit, HOV, and multimodal access. Also new ramps to the north will allow bus rapid transit to serve communities in north county and provide access to the future light rail station near the Ash Way Park and Ride.”
The Ash Way area is going to be quite interesting with the arrival of Link. I just hope WSDOT, ST and CT will truly work together in the design process of new HOV ramps and light rail station placement.
Personally, I prefer a station on the east side of the freeway, giving more access to businesses and doesn’t force Mill Creek residents to cross the freeway to access light rail.
I think Snohomish county (gov) had a slight preference for an east side station as well. I’m kind of ambivalent on either alignment.
Though honestly probably sound transit will stick with a westside alignment — both the alderwood mall and mariner stations will be on the west side. It’ll be quite expensive to weave across i-5 twice and the pros are only weakly in favor for the east side.
@Mike Orr,
In addition to all the standard BRT attributes, Swift Orange provides two additional benefits:
1). It provides a roughly east-west BRT route to complement the pre-existing roughly north-south Swift Blue and Green routes. Think “grid”.
2). It provides connectivity. Between all 3 Swift routes and also with Link.
The last point is key. Many people will be using Swift Orange to access Link at LTC. Access to Link is one of the key attributes of Swift Orange.
So how was LTC Station and the new Link transfer? I know it isn’t open yet, but it is right there and hard to miss. Comments?
Ditto for the Blue to Orange connection. Comments?
Note: many people will also be using Swift Blue to access Link. The transfer from Blue-to-Link at 185th St Station will be particularly good, but I suspect some people will also do Blue-to-Orange-to-Link at LTC.
The end of summer is coming fast! First LLE will open and then the restructures will occur. Six months from now it will be an entirely different world.
It was hard to tell where the Link station entrances would be so I didn’t get a sense of that. I was focusing on Swift-512 transfers. Somebody else may have a better analysis of Swift-Link transfers.
@Mike Orr,
Swift-512 transfers will go away when the 512 goes away.
And the 512 will go away, probably 6 months or so after LLE opens in late summer.
What will remain will be the Swift-Link transfers, both at LTC and at 185th St stations. Swift-Link transfers are the future of Seattle-SnoCo transit.
I was focusing on what’s available now, not what will be available in six months or maybe fifteen years. You can’t ride future service, only current service.
Won’t the 512 persist with frequent service between Everett and Lynnwood TCs? It seems that there probably will be a lot of transfers between the 512 and Swift given their headways.
@Mike Orr,
“ I was focusing on what’s available now”
I’m always looking forward, always looking to the future.
And, in this case, the future is only about 5 months away. Come end of August there won’t be any reason to take the 512. It’s toast.
Come end of August there won’t be any reason to take the 512. It’s toast.
Wait, what? Are you saying no one will take the 512 because they will take the 201/202?
> So how was LTC Station and the new Link transfer? I know it isn’t open yet, but it is right there and hard to miss. Comments?
Haven’t personally used the orange swift yet, but ive used the previous routes from the transit center. Looks like a relatively easy walk across the street. There’s not that much traffic on 46th ave w besides buses.
https://www.communitytransit.org/route/703
https://i0.wp.com/seattletransitblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/lynnwoodsta.jpg
I have used the park and ride garage, and you pass by a station entrance on the walkway between the garage elevators and the busses. And the Swift bus stop is in the bus bay closes to the station. It is a very direct connection, at least to the station entrance at the surface. The only potential snafu I see is that there is a signalized crosswalk that I doubt is “on demand,” and it might occasionally make you wait just long enough to miss a connection. The crosswalk could have been painted wider as well, might not be quite wide enough at peak hours.
There is escalator and elevator access to the station on the south side of the HOV ramp road. The EB stop will be just a walk across the plaza, the WB stop will require crossing the transit center roadway.
@ninja,
Interesting. I thought both Swift Orange stops were on the main bus island, sort of on the east end of it. Meaning both EB and WB Swift Orange transfers to Link would require crossing the main road to access the Light Rail station.
Guess I’ll need to get up there and check it out personally.
There should be an announcement today regarding the date for Lynnwood Link opening. There should also be announcements regarding the dates for the supporting bus restructures (should be after LLE opens).
So all this will gain some clarity soon. It will be nice to have the information embargo on these dates finally lifted.
1). It provides a roughly east-west BRT route to complement the pre-existing roughly north-south Swift Blue and Green routes. Think “grid”.
Sorta, but that is a bit of a stretch. It goes across part of 164th, but then turns south on 36th. As a result it doesn’t get very close to the 101, let alone the main Swift line (Blue) for SR 99. The east-west segment between Alderwood and the college is good though.
2). It provides connectivity. Between all 3 Swift routes and also with Link.
Yes, but not in a particularly great way. It goes back and forth and various combinations are awkward, to say the least. Orange to Blue works, but only one direction, and even then a bit awkwardly (as I mentioned). Orange to Green has a nice overlap (same stop transfer — hurray) but just about every trip involves backtracking (boo). It works for Link, but just about every bus that serves Lynnwood TC does. Meanwhile, Ash Way to Link is done much better with the 201/202 (or the 512 if you don’t mind walking).
Swift Orange strikes me as a BRT looking for a route, not the other way around. It zigs and zags at various places like the worst of Metro’s Rapid Ride, the infamous F (which I believe stands for WTF is this bus doing?). In this case though it seems like it is worse, in that it saps precious service hours while not providing enough in return. It seems like a coordinated set of routes would accomplish much the same with better results. For example the most common trip pair may very well be Lynnwood Transit Center to Edmonds Community College. But maybe this is best achieved with a spine since there are a lot of buses coming from the east (to the station) and plenty coming from the west (to the college). The frequency of this “BRT” is good, but I could easily see buses running more often along the corridor.
RapidRide mnenomic:
A: federal wAy
B: Bellevue
C: west C-attle
D: ballarD
E: aurorE or Eurora
F: F*ing too many turns
G: maGison
H: deHlridge
I: kInt
J: Joosevelt
K: Kirkland
R: Rainier
Ross, by Red do you mean Orange?
The biggest trouble I’ve had is writing Gold instead of Orange and then having to correct it. I think we’ve found the limit of BRT-color memorability.
Ross, by Red do you mean Orange?
Yes. I’ll correct it. I noticed it earlier and thought I fixed it — oh well. I think it is odd that they skipped over red and went with orange. When I glance at the map it seems red (and since there is no red …). Maybe they want to avoid the term “Red Line” because of the history.
Three of these stops are identified as “park and ride”. However, Lynnwood Link has added 500 more spaces (1670 total). Plus, any user won’t ride all the way to Seattle from these three Orange Line stops; so they’ll have to change to Link to get to Seattle instead..
I can’t say how demand to use these lots will change when Link opens. However, I suspect demand at these non-Link lots will drop significantly and maybe even be totally empty beyond a few carpoolers.
It’s not a bad thing. It might be a great site for higher density housing, for example. However, it seems to me that a more generic term like a “mobility hub” or “junction” could have been used instead — or maybe the term just shouldn’t be used in naming a stop.
The Orange has at least four P&R stations. That’s another thing that would disappoint King County urbanists, but it’s how Snohomish County is, and those P&Rs are probably the best station locations available. Ash Way P&R has apartments and nearby houses. McClollum has a transit-accessible park. Lynnwood has downtown Lynnwood. I don’t know what Swamp Creek has or why people use it. I don’t know why Snohomish has Mariner AND McClollum P&Rs so close together, or Swamp Creek AND Ash Way. But maybe there’s a reason. People may start driving to the Lynnwood Link station and leave the northern P&Rs more empty, but I don’t know how much, or how long until Lynnwood P&R fills up and people have to use the other ones.
@Mike Orr,
“ People may start driving to the Lynnwood Link station and leave the northern P&Rs more empty”
Ya, there will probably be some of this.
People who are already driving to a PaR to catch a bus might just drive a bit further and catch Link directly (as opposed to driving to a PaR, catching a bus to LTC, and then transferring to Link).
And there will certainly be that odd two week transitionary period between when LLE opens and when the bus restructures occur. A small subset of riders might drive to a Link Station directly until such time as the bus restructures kick in and they get a more convenient feeder bus.
To be clear, I’m not commenting on the location; just the name.
I’m actually wondering if they’ll do things like switch some parking spaces for bicycle lockers or something like that. That’s why I suggested using a more generic name like “hub”.
> McClollum P&R
It’s technically “McCollum Park” Park and Ride. Aka it’s the park’s parking lot, but it’s used for commuters as well. I’m not sure of the full history if it’s been expanded, but typically the parks’ parking lots are underutilized during the day when everyone’s at work. It’s part of a landfill so it’s hard to build anything substantial on it anyways.
> Swamp Creek AND Ash Way
Swamp creek was expanded as the overflow for ash way, but as you noted, I’m not sure how many will use it once one is forced. to transfer versus parking at lynnwood.
I checked the psrc analysis for the swamp creek. Even at am peak there was only 302 cars parked there while it holds 400 parking spots “Figure 12 shows boardings by route and time of day at Swamp Creek Park and Ride. 94% of boardings take place in the AM peak, almost entirely on routes
headed to downtown Seattle and the University of Washington.”
No one is heading to bellevue or everett from swamp creek park and ride so I guess it can probably be closed and converted to something else.
https://www.psrc.org/sites/default/files/2022-03/164thsttransitaccesscasestudy20160125.pdf
Ash Way park and ride on the other hand has people using it for everett, edmonds and even mill creek both peak and midday so it’ll continue being useful.
“It’s technically “McCollum Park” Park and Ride.”
Is the “Park” in the name recent or has it always been that? When I saw the express buses in the U-District and downtown they said “McCollum P&R”, not “McCollum Park P&R”.
When I read that a bus stop is called “park and ride” I think it messages users that the primary reason to use that stop is for that purpose. It kind of suggests that there is no neighborhood or destination; just asphalt parking spaces.
Examples: McCollum Park is an interesting place; not merely as asphalt parking lot. Ash Way is across from the Newberry Square shopping center so Ash Way/ Newberry sounds more enticing than the park and ride moniker they gave the stop. Swamp Creek has a large Fred Meyer with several interesting restaurants next to it, so calling it something like Swamp Creek Junction sounds lots more enticing on a transit map.
Of course, locals should know better. But I’d be more likely (as a Seattle resident) to check out using the Orange Line if I saw on the map it had stops without the “park and ride” moniker attached.
I think, regardless of what people driving to the train will do, the northern P&R’s will still continue to be used by carpools and vanpools.
Interesting point about Lynnwood station: The SOV car access for cars to/from I-5 does not look to be the best, especially during congested times. This might make it worth it for SOV drivers to park further north during peak hours.
From the north: Technically SOV drivers are supposed to get off at 196th, drive past the convention center, and turn left at 44th Ave, which involves several red lights and can get congested. In the reverse, kind of even worse, since you can’t turn left directly onto 44th, you need to deal with 200th first. It makes me wonder how many SOV drivers will cheat and use the HOV ramps (e.g., like at South Everett), and whether this might slow down the busses. It doesn’t look like the access from the bus/HOV ramps to the garage is that great either, since you would need to drive around the garage and enter from the other side, and there would be the added frustration of the I-5 congestion between the 196th offramp and the bus/HOV exit, so it might well be a wash. I can all this being enough of a hassle that you park at Ash Way or even South Everett and take the 512 instead (Swift Orange would be too slow), especially if/when it’s not guaranteed to get a parking spot at Lynnwood. But I can also see enough people sneaking onto the HOV ramp to cause a real backup if it is not better enforced, in which case, the bus would be less appealing.
Coming from the South: After the SOV ramp at the 44th Ave. exit, it is a left turn, then a U-turn. In the reverse direction, no red light between you and the freeway. Much easier. Although you’re probably not driving to Lynnwood TC from the south to begin with.
I could see changing the name, given how these areas become less important as park and ride lots. From what I can tell the bus doesn’t actually go into the Swamp Creek Park and Ride lot. Like Ash Way, there are some apartments nearby. So yeah, I could definitely see changing the name of the stop to just “Swamp Creek” or the cross street (Wildwood Drive).
In contrast I can see several reasons why you keep the name “Ash Way Park and Ride”. First, the bus will definitely detour to the park and ride lot. Otherwise riders would have a long walk to connect to other buses (that use the HOV freeway ramps). I wouldn’t call the stop just “Ash Way” since Ash Way is a street and the map shows the bus going up Ash Way. Folks might wonder how far up Ash Way it goes, which is way labeling it “Ash Way Park and Ride” makes it clear. It is basically a transit center, so I could see it being renamed to that. But since plenty of people will continue to use the parking lot (for other reasons as mentioned) I don’t see any reason to change it.
McCollum Park Park and Ride is just begging for a rename. Just call it McCollum Park. So yeah, I think Ash Way would be the only stop on the map labeled Park and Ride, although I might have symbols for park and ride lots (like Metro does).
The Swamp Creek Orange Line station is in a really odd/interesting place right now – situated closer to housing and a bit of a walk from retail – there’s a new apartment coming up next to it (and there are a number to the north/northwest); there’s also the Avalon apartments + Fred Meyer plaza on Alderwood Mall Blvd a block away.
It’s currently served by a bunch of CT commuter routes, the 112, and Swift Orange, but after the LLE restructure this fall, only the 112 + Swift Orange will serve it, which seems to further diminish its need. Hopefully we’ll see it redeveloped into apartments or a mixed-use development given that I don’t see many folks using it as a P&R after those routes go away.
Between Ash Way and Lynnwood Station the Orange, 512, and 201/202 overlap, although at different stops. So if you’re going to Seattle and come to Ash Way P&R on foot, the Orange station will be the closest, and the next-arrival display will tell if it’s coming soon. If it isn’t, you can go into the P&R and take one of the others. If you’re coming from another bus route, it will stop inside the P&R, so you’ll probably stay there and take the 201, 202, or 512, since they all go on I-5 and will be faster than the Orange. Except when they’re too infrequent to wait for; then you might go out to the Orange.
I looked up the future Marysville Swift line. It’s the Gold Line, and will terminate at Everett Station, so it won’t go to Ash Way or Lynnwood. Presumably the southern part of the 201/202 will be restructured into something else. Or if CT decides it isn’t needed with the 512 and Gold, it may reassign the hours to other routes. The only Gold route map I could find was on the PSRC website; it says it will launch in 2027.
> The only Gold route map I could find was on the PSRC website; it says it will launch in 2027.
As a side note, in the most recent documents I don’t see the “silver line” to seaway transit center. I still see the east extension of swift along 132nd ave, but then the other extension is to downtown edmonds via 196th ave (state route 524) in purple
I can’t find any other documents referring to it, but it looks like an orange line extension west to downtown edmonds and east to glacier peak high school??
https://www.economicalliancesc.org/media/userfiles/subsite_201/files/SnoCoRegionalPriorityProjectsRev12-22-22.pdf
I wish CT would have more information on its own projects. The Silver Line may be the Highway 9 one. That was once listed as “ridership not there yet but may be in the future”. Seaway-Cathcart suggests the 128th Street one, but the Green Line already serves part of that. An earlier version of the Orange Line would have gone east to Silver Firs (east of Mill Creek), but it was sent to McCollum Park P&R instead. Maybe there was a reorganization.
There was a political incentive to accelerate the Green Line to Boeing, so maybe it was also important to connect it to Canyon Park and that superceded earlier concepts. I could maybe see somebody from Kirkland taking the Stride 2 to Canyon Park and transferring to the Green to Boeing. Or rather I can’t because of the travel time, but Snohomish County may have seen it as priority.
If you are going from Ash Way Park and Ride to Link then the 201/202 and 512 will be much faster. By my calculations is saves about 10 minutes (midday). The Orange Line is more frequent, but not that much more frequent. Both the 201/202 and 512 run every 15 minutes. If they timed them opposite each other that would be more frequent than the Orange Line.
I don’t see the Orange Link as helping those riders that much. I think it is more that it complements that service. There are a fair number of apartments close to Swamp Creek Park and Ride (and some of the other stops). Thus this not only gets them to Link, but it also connects them to 201/202 and 512 (making a two-seat ride to Everett a lot faster). Likewise the 201/202 run on Ash Way itself, which means they serve the apartments along the way. The Orange Line makes it easier for them to get to Alderwood (they don’t backtrack).
It’s on the Community Transit website.
https://www.communitytransit.org/swift
https://www.communitytransit.org/docs/default-source/pdfs/projects/swift-green/swift-network-extension_factsheet-update_1589.pdf?sfvrsn=5e5b2cb_3
I also don’t think it is being labeled the silver line, grey was used to denote possible corridors for Swift lines in the future.
The 5th line was originally called the “silver line”. It’s on page 68 of the devleopment plan as well.
Swift BRT Silver Line – Airport Road to Cathcart Way (Everett)
Service hours and buses. Core Service or Swift Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) on Airport Rd, 128th, 132nd, Cathcart Way from SR 526 to SR 9. Requires speed & reliability improvements and accessible transit stop
Estimated cost $46,255,119
https://www.communitytransit.org/docs/default-source/pdfs/adopted-2023-2028-transit-development-plan.pdf?sfvrsn=8f22a939_1#page=68
However, it does look like community transit is backing away/changing their plans as in other documents they’ve dropped mention of the silver line and in the 2023 regional projects lists for snohomish county I see an extension to edmonds downtown proposed instead.
https://www.economicalliancesc.org/media/userfiles/subsite_201/files/SnoCoRegionalPriorityProjectsRev12-22-22.pdf
Either way though, the 4th and next swift line will be the gold line to marysville
Also here. https://www.communitytransit.org/docs/default-source/pdfs/adopted-2023-2028-transit-development-plan.pdf?sfvrsn=8f22a939_1
Page 39
According to Community Transit it’s 10-12 mins during the week not 12-15 just fyi.
https://www.communitytransit.org/landing-pages/advertising/orange-line/swift-orange-line-landing?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw_LOwBhBFEiwAmSEQAV_UbQbGE1fN0aSFVPsz_k4obmNNx4S5JoeVL6ggt8mQpu5qi-d3-xoCqhMQAvD_BwE
Good catch. 10-12 is much better.
I meant to write 10-12. I corrected the article.
@Mike Orr, I think that instead of “the upcoming Stream BRT.” you meant Sound Transit’s Stride BRT.
@Ross Bleakney, I think that instead of “Stride Orange,” you meant “Swift Orange.” Your points are well taken. Orange duplicates much of the 115/116 routing from before, a route which was greatly slowed by significant traffic along particularly 164th, and where the agency didn’t seem to get much in the way of concessions – if any – from Mill Creek or Lynnwood in particular. Another flaw, which is the result of top-down decision making at CT, was the decision to loop the bus up Ash Way at the roundabout, which was done because the county couldn’t be convinced of the need for a traffic light at the exit to the bus loop. A better option – and more beneficial in the long run – would have been creating an opening from 164th to enter the parking lot from the south, with the station at the south end, just below the bus loop and with an existing traffic light on the west side. This alternative would have also meant less of an incline and no interference from the other buses, particularly important during icy weather. I once sat on a bus for 45 minutes perhaps 1000 feet north of the SB 164th exit from I-5 to get to the bus stop in the loop. And, of course, planners insist on BRT running more frequently than ridership demand at certain times of the day, although I suspect that its ridership will surpass and will be more uniform than for Swift Green’s, the latter more of a peak-only bus than a 16 hour/day operation, but then cost ($200-300/hour) is not a consideration in those decisions, only total ridership, which is what is typically touted, not what it cost to get those riders nor the fluctuations in ridership, for if they did, more service could be provided for more people in more places than under the current, passive, “one size fits all” model that transit decision makers, few of which ride the service, prefer.
I think that instead of “Stride Orange,” you meant “Swift Orange.”
Yes (oops). Thanks for the correction. I’ll change my comment.
I agree with your other points. The Ash Way situation is disappointing. It is an essential transfer point (along with a park and ride). They county should make getting to that point much easier.
“instead of “the upcoming Stream BRT.” you meant Sound Transit’s Stride BRT.”
Corrected.
Supposedly, there are plans to extend the bus-only I-5 access to Meadow Rd on the east side of I-5, which could prove to be a useful route for Swift Orange, bypassing the left-turn onto eastbound 164th, hough I haven’t seen any concrete plans for this aside from funding discussions.
There is a new traffic light at the bus entrance/exit for Ash Way P&R now, though this seems to only benefit non-Swift buses since the Orange Line doesn’t use the bus loop.
I mentioned it briefly in an above comment. I’ll copy it again below:
I-5 (164th Street SW Texas T) – Mill Creek ($85 million): “This project will improve the direct access ramp at Ash Way Park & Ride by providing a new connection to the east over I-5 for transit, HOV, and multimodal access. Also new ramps to the north will allow bus rapid transit to serve communities in north county and provide access to the future light rail station near the Ash Way Park and Ride.”
https://snohomishcountywa.gov/DocumentCenter/View/80870/SnoCoRegionalPriorityProjectsRev1_0321
https://www.economicalliancesc.org/media/userfiles/subsite_201/files/SnoCoRegionalPriorityProjectsRev12-22-22.pdf
They’ll probably move forward with this project.
[I’m moving this from a different thread.]
Swift is the closest thing this region has to real BRT
Uh, no. I would say the RapidRide A or E are the closest to real BRT. The E is more frequent and both carry a lot more riders per service hour. RapidRide G will soon be the most “BRT” of all the routes once it opens.
And one of the great things about Swift Orange is its direct connection to Link at LTCM.
Yes, just like a dozen other buses. That really isn’t the issue. Swift uses a lot of service hours. Same can be said with RapidRide (and just frequent buses like the 7) but Swift isn’t efficient. RapidRide has its flaws but on several corridors RapidRide is the only route. For almost the entire way the H is the only bus on Delridge. Same with Aurora and the E or SR 99 and the A. It means that if you are going *anywhere* along the corridor, you catch that bus. There are some places that overlap, but they are minor. From a network standpoint, this makes a huge difference. It means the agency can run buses elsewhere more often.
In contrast the Orange overlaps several buses. So much so that it isn’t obvious that the Orange line is even necessary. A spine for a lot of these routes might be just as good. This is turn could lead to savings that result in say, Edmonds getting a bus every 15 minutes (which was the thread topic this branched off of).
Consider trying to get from Lynnwood Transit Center to Edmonds Community College. This will probably become the most popular trip-pair of the Orange Line. The Orange runs every ten minutes* (which is great). But it won’t be the only bus making that trip. The 114 and 166 will also go between there. Both of those will run every half hour. So that is 8 buses an hour going between Edmonds College and Lynnwood TC (Link). But the buses won’t be coordinated (they can’t be). If you just miss the Orange you might be able to catch another bus, or you might have to wait ten minutes. In contrast it is possible to coordinate buses so that you have 7.5 minute frequency *at no extra cost*. For example a couple of 15-minute routes can run opposite each other. That would mean better frequency along this essential corridor.
The same is true on various parts of the Orange Line. It overlaps the Green Line on part of SR 527. There are some apartments and retail there, but this isn’t the kind of place where you would expect to see 11 buses per hour (the Green runs every 12 minutes). Several buses overlap on 164th as well. Again, this is understandable as it is a major corridor and Ash Way Park & Ride is basically a major transit center. But the Orange Line doesn’t go across SR 99 at 164th (it doesn’t come close to Swift Blue there). This means a lot of those riders are better off taking one of the other buses. Finally there is 36th. The 103 also goes along 36th instead of going straight up 44th. This sounds OK except the 112 goes on 44th. If the 103 followed the 112 it would mean (potentially) a bus every 15 minutes along this important corridor. And no, I’m not saying that 44th is as strong a corridor as 36th (it isn’t) but the combination is just inefficient.
I think that Swift has many of the same problems as RapidRide — and then some. It suffers from the same “ribbon cutting” desire for monuments. And yes, I get it. Swift Blue was a major accomplishment for Snohomish County. It made it clear to the world that Snohomish County was serious about transit. As I’ve written before the model may actually be appropriate for that corridor. I’m not convinced it is for the other ones. I feel like much of Snohomish County is very close to having quite a few corridors with 15 minute service (like the 201/202). I can tell you from personal experience that this changes the way you view transit. When Metro did a restructure after U-Link they ended up with a lot of buses running 15 minutes. It was inconvenient in a lot of ways but the game paid off, and ridership soared. I feel like Community Transit is not that far from doing the same thing for a good portion of their service area. Swift may actually be hurting, rather than helping in that regard.
* Frequency is stated on midday based on the future plans (https://www.communitytransit.org/transitchanges).
Travel time matters too. Swift takes 40 minutes from Edmonds College to Mill Creek, and that’s not even including the part north of 164th. A full-stop route would take even longer. Forty minutes is a lot of time to spend to cross a relatively short distance, and it may be only part of your trip. When you say limited-stop routes don’t matter, you’re throwing people taking longer trips under the bus.
The swift lines could probably go from 1 mile stop spacing down to like say 0.5 mile stop spacing and it’d be much more walkable and the travel time difference wouldn’t be as large.
The green line and orange line actually already have lowered bus stop spacing compared to the blue line. Sections of the green line already don’t have a shadow bus line.
In general I do find the Orange line a bit weird. It maintains the 0.7 stop mile spacing for speed but then at the same time takes a bunch of detours unlike the Blue or Green line.
When you say limited-stop routes don’t matter, you’re throwing people taking longer trips under the bus.
No, I’m saying they would be better off with more frequent buses. The Orange Line is not that long. The longest trip is not that long. Assume for a second that it is the weekend and you are trying to get from McCollum Park to the college (the entire length of the Orange Line). There are two options:
1) The Orange Line runs as it does now with wide stop spacing. The bus runs every 20 minutes.
2) The bus has standard international stop spacing (1/4 mile). It runs every 10 minutes.
It isn’t even close. Obviously the second option is better. As for really long trips, they will likely involve a transfer. For example from Everett to the apartments on 36th. This would mean riding the 201/202 from Everett, transferring to the Orange and riding it from there. This is a long trip, and the most important thing for the Orange is that it be frequent, not that there are huge gaps between stops. If anything, the lack of coverage is worse than any gain in speed.
But that isn’t the worst problem. It is overall frequency. Not on the Orange Line itself, but the network as a whole. Overlapping buses creates inefficiency. This in turn hurts all the buses. When folks wonder why there are no frequent buses to Edmonds, one of the many reasons is because the Swift Lines have overlapping routes on them. Part of the reason they have overlapping routes is because they have special “shadows”.
I’m also not saying that Swift Blue is a mistake. Mostly I’m saying that Swift Blue is very different than Swift Orange. There are several fairly unusual things that make Swift Blue a reasonable approach:
1) The corridor is very long.
2) It is largely straight, with no direct transit alternatives (you would have to transfer).
3) The density levels vary quite a bit along the corridor. There are strong destinations (like Downtown Everett, the hospital, the college and the connection to RapidRide) as well as areas that have basically nothing.
4) A different agency (Everett Transit) runs a bus along a good part of the corridor. This reduces the amount of coverage that is necessary with a second bus.
5) The corridor carries a very high proportion of the ridership for the agency.
Thus there are probably a fairly high number of riders that ride a long ways (and thus benefit from the very wide stop spacing). So much so that it is worth the extra cost. In contrast, I don’t see that with the Orange Line. The vast majority of trips on the Orange Line will be pretty short. I expect the most common trip (by far) to be from Lynnwood TC to the college. Some trip combinations don’t make sense with this bus — for example Ash Way Park and Ride to Lynnwood TC. You are much better off with the 201/202 or the 512. This effects connecting routes as well. If you are trying to get from SeaWay to Lynnwood TC you will take the Green Line and then transfer to the 201/202 at Mariner. If you are trying to get from SeaWay to the college you just transfer to the Blue Line. I just don’t see many long trips taken with the Orange Line. This makes it a lot different than the Blue Line.
I feel like Community Transit basically stumbled into an usual pattern (limited stop bus route with a shadow) and it worked out really for them. They then started looking around for other areas where the same approach would work, and it just doesn’t. You either have long corridors with every few people or you have something like the Orange Line, which is basically just a hodgepodge of route sections tied together (that should have normal stop spacing).
Too bad the Orange Line runs only every 20 minutes on the weekend. It tells me that Community Transit caters to weekday commuters but not people who use transit to get around on the weekend for shopping, travelling and dining out.
It tells me Community Transit has a limited budget. Swift originally started with 10-minute service. 20-minute started due to recessions and other budget limitations, and has expanded/contracted ever since. Someday CT will hopefully have the funding to run all Swift lines every 10 minutes every day, and Metro for its RapidRide and Frequent routes, but we’re a long way’s from that. More intra-county CT service will come with the Lynnwood Link restructure.
A limited budget means prioritization. For Community Transit, it’s obviously more important to run Orange every 10 minutes during off-peak hours on weekdays than provide more frequent service during the day on the weekend. I do agree that it would be great if CT could run Swift every 10 minutes every day. Some day.
It may be a staffing problem. It is possible they just don’t have enough drivers for the weekend. It is also possible it is related to federal grants. I assume that Community Transit got some matching money to do the work for the line. In order to do this, they have to guarantee a certain level of service. But I think that only applies weekday during the day. A similar phenomenon will occur with RapidRide G. The bus will run every 6 minutes during the day. Frequency then drops to every 15 minutes at 7:00 PM weekdays. Saturday follows the same pattern, whereas Sunday buses will run every 15 minutes throughout the day.
This is a huge drop off. Every bus transitions to less frequency at night, and lots of buses have less frequency on the weekends, but the change should not be so extreme. For example the E goes from running every 7.5 minutes to 10 in the evening to 15 minutes at night. The RapidRide G should do the same (going from 6 minutes to 7.5 to 10). Likewise, the Orange should run every 15 minutes at worse on the weekends.